I think I'm going to have to go in.

[gvr4ever]

I think I am going to have to go in and check the head gasket. How are the Felpro parts for HG and studs?

 

[Vr4junkie]

Felpro has been around for a while the head gaskets are good i personal never used one on a vr4 but i have used them on other cars i have worked on. last one I used was on a ga16de and quality looks good another thing I liked was that it was made in japan which was a plus since it was a nissan.

I have a buddy that has a shop and he always has gaskets laying around and i seen a Felpro gasket kit for some Chevy he was working on the feel look and quality of the gaskets looked to be good.

if this is going to be a stock car or maybe just a few bolt on mods i think you should be good I would also cooper spay the HG.

 

[James]

I know high power cars tuning felpro kits and I know low end cars running felpro kits. So far every gasket on my car is felpro.

 

[asmo]

The stock mits gasket for our cars is only like $68 from the dealer, a local here ran one at 27 psi on a drag car all season and had no problems.
not the mls one either the stock graphite one!. Im sure everyone is gonna chime in to get mls but they cost $110 and you really dont need them on a stock or mild build car = less than 30psi.

 

[GSTwithPSI]

Quoting vr4junkie:
if this is going to be a stock car or maybe just a few bolt on mods i think you should be good I would also cooper spay the HG.



Never spray copper coating on a head gasket. The Felpro composite gasket fully seals when it is heated by the engine. Copper spray won't allow the gasket to do this. I believe the gasket instructions even say to be sure to mount it dry. Make sure your mating surfaces are true and clean, slap on the gasket and torque the head to spec. The end.

 

[5OF2k]

Couple things:

Felpro is a good replacement for a stock/near stock car. Cheaper than the Mitsu graphite unite, but basically a spitting image of it, so youd be fine there.

DO NOT copper spray the headgasket. Being as our cars have iron blocks and aluminum heads, they expand at different rates asthey warm up. Copper gasket can inhibit that, and not let them expand as they need to and you could wind up with seepage from the gasket or premature failure of the gasket. The factory service manual (OEM Mitsu 4g63 engine manual) doesnt recommend it either, FWIW.

If you're planning on doing any sort of upgrades to the car, increasing the power output, boltog on a higher flowing thrbo setup/etc, whats the harm in gettig a set of ARP headstuds and running the OEM mitsu MLS? I've run the evo8 MLS on most of the builds ive done for people and myself, and have found theyre bulletproof when coupled with headstuds to around 525-550hp. No only that, its one less thing for you to worry about down the road. An insurance policy, if you will.

Hope that helps! I know you'll wind up doing whatever you justify to yourself as the best way to go, just had to give my .02.

-Jake

 

[DynastyLCD]

^ i agree

hell, even if you went cheap, you could get the Cometic MLS with ARP's brand new for $162 on ExtremePSI. add in another $100 bucks or so for a head resurfacing and whatever else for coolant and oil, and you're good to go for a long time and a good amount of boost and abuse!

 

[turbowop]

I sprayed a light coating of copper spray on the Mitsu MLS HG in 1051 when I installed it back in '03. Never pushed a drop of coolant or leaked anything. It's seen 30+ psi and methanol injection for years. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

 

[5OF2k]

Thats the MLS, it's different. The graphite gaskets dont have multiple layers, and bond to the surfaces of the metals theyre sealing, which in effect seals it. The benefit of the MLS gaskets are the layers. The bottom layer bonds to the deck surface, top to the had surface, while the middle layers allow the gasket to heat and expand at different rates while keeping everything sealed and hunky-dory.

Make sense?

-Jake

 

[gvr4ever]

Thanks for the feedback. I'm going to pull the plugs and see if I can smell coolant, but basically my car runs on 3cyls till warm(15min) and then randomly breaks up after that. I had sent my ECU off to EMC Tuning just to make sure everything was okay on that end. Everything is fine, but they said they had the exact same problem on one of their cars. They said I could have a coolant leak on the HG and have good compression.

Everything fuel and spark has been checked and or replaced. I had a bad thermostat last year that opened too late. I changed it as soon as I noticed a problem, but it was probably too late. I think maybe the problem might have just slowly got worse.

Aside from trying to smell for coolant, is their another way I could check? Oil isn't mixing in the coolant or the other way around. Or if it is, its such a small amount it isn't obvious.

I was looking at FEL-PRO Part # 9627PT and FEL-PRO Part # ES71175 from Rock Auto. I don't track the car and at most I run 18psi, but normally I just run 11.

I also couldn't find a good write up on vfaq.com Does anyone know of a good source for instructions?

 

[turbowop]

Quoting 5OF2k:
Thats the MLS, it's different. The graphite gaskets dont have multiple layers, and bond to the surfaces of the metals theyre sealing, which in effect seals it. The benefit of the MLS gaskets are the layers. The bottom layer bonds to the deck surface, top to the had surface, while the middle layers allow the gasket to heat and expand at different rates while keeping everything sealed and hunky-dory.

Make sense?

-Jake




I understand that the Felpro HG does not require copper spray and that you actually shouldn't use it. You made it sound as though it's bad for any headgasket, hence my reply.

 

[JNR]

Felpro used to make real good stuff and hopefully they are the same...Haven't used any of their stuff in years, but I'd buy one if the price were right.

Was going to suggest to be sure your block and especially head (being alum.) are nice and flat, or else you'll be doing this again shortly /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[ApexHunter]

Note that MLS gaskets usually require smoother surfaces than composite gaskets. So if you don't resurface BOTH the block and the head, the composite gasket may be a better choice. I know that some people have not resurfaced one or the other or maybe both and not encountered any problems. The condition of the surface may have been in decent enough shape so that it was not a necessity.

 

[JNR]

Surface finish is important, although I was referring more to warping or out of spec 'flatness' where no gasket will be enough to fill those voids...Probably not a common thing for it to be way out of whack (esp. on the the iron block), it is something to check if you have a blown gasket, as something caused the issue in the first place so it's important to address that first, of course...Remember milling down the head (if trying to get it flat) will cause your compression to be raised, so get a thicker gasket if that's an issue.

 

[gvr4ever]

Quoting JNR:
Felpro used to make real good stuff and hopefully they are the same...Haven't used any of their stuff in years, but I'd buy one if the price were right.

Was going to suggest to be sure your block and especially head (being alum.) are nice and flat, or else you'll be doing this again shortly /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif



Ya, I was going to call Fathouse Fabrications out of Indy first. I don't know if they do in house machine work or outsource it, but they are known to build some good engines.

Before I order anything, I'll pull the head, make sure the cyl walls are smooth and have the head done before I order anything.

I've miss placed my factory manuals during too many moves or something. Is their a PDF or good instructions for doing this? I'm sure I could get it off no problem, but I'd want detailed instructions for putting it back on(torque specs and method).

I figured TDC, pull t-belt, remove intake manifold, exhaust manifold, valve cover, then head bolts. That about right?

 

[presterone]

Copper spray has acetone in it which dissolves the factory silicone ''looking'' sealant in headgaskets. If you find something like alchohol to clean the sealer or something mild that wont ruin the gasket material, and then spray it with copper or hylomar blue you will be mint. If its a MLS gasket pull apart the layers, clean the sealant and spray copper between the layers. Again not absolutely necessary but the acetone is one of the most common reasons for people having bad luck with spraying gaskets. It eats the sealant

 

[Vr4junkie]

Never knew that I cooper sprayed a felpro HG on a 1.6 sentra engine and have not had a problem block nor head were decked and i been daily driving it ever since.

I heard mixed reviews about this hopefully it stays sealed be a dam shame if i would have to replace the gasket again only time will tell.