Idle issues associated with Tial BOV?

[VR_IV_MR]

OK so my car is at the shop right now for the ETS FMIC install. I had a used tial Q BOV that I figured I would use with the setup. However, the shop is telling me that "The car doesn't like to hold an idle with the Tial blow off valve. Cars seem to be hit or miss with a vented BOV and your Galant doesn't like it one bit. We adjusted the airflow values which helped but it is still rough to get it to idle when you drop it out of gear. Speed Density in ECMLink would solve that problem but introduces more work to setup a SD system."


Robert from ETS said, "My personally recommendation would be to either go speed density and run a custom intake or switch the BOV out to a 1G or greddy bov and I can remake you a pipe flanged for this. I have tried to run vented BOVs on my GVR4 and they just do not run good. Even with tuning and using the MAF clamp function in ECMLink."


Unfortunately I come across this information, AFTER the fact. Is there any advice someone can lend? I eventually wanted to convert to speed density, but I didn't want to do that until I could afford a new intake manifold. Does anyone have a tial Q bov running smooth with a 3g MAS?


Thanks...

 

[5OF2k]

Also, the way the Tial is designed, when setup properly it'll be ever so slightly opened, then as soon as the throttle plate opens it'll shut. I can see where it's be an issue if you are running a factory/2g/evo MAF. However, you should be able to run a GM 3"/Translator with zero issues, so long as it's put inline after the BOV, like most MAF/Trans setups are.

Honestly, if you dont have a 3"MAF/Trans already, you should. Theyre worth it, as is a SD setup, but the MAF/Trans is much easier to tune/deal with if you've never used SD.

Hope that helps!

-Jake

**EDIT** just saw you have a 3G MAS

 

[5OF2k]

Also, FWIW, I've been running Tial BOVs for YEARS with either a GM MAF setup, or SD setup.

Both work great.

-Jake

 

[VR_IV_MR]

Yeah well thats the thing... I have ECMLink v3 already, so all I would need is the sensors and the drilling into the intake manifold correct? Maybe ill just go SD... Ugh!

 

[5OF2k]

I'd do it man, you can find the sensors and such you need for pretty cheap. It'll get you more power too with a decent tune, FWIW.

DOOOO EEEEEET!!

-Jake

 

[G]

Your car not running right has nothing to do with the tial bov and everything to do with it not being vented back in to the intake stream. Any bov hks, greddy, stock etc.........will give you the same problem. Sounds like this shop doesn't know what they are doing.

 

[5OF2k]

It's exxaggerated on the Tials because they're designed to be open slightly at idle.

 

[VR_IV_MR]

So my only practical solutions would be to use the old stock bov or to setup speed density? Seems keeping it stock might be alot easier and cheaper for the time being. I like to do my research on this kind of stuff and I just dont have the time right now.

 

[MX4]

With the Tial BOV you have to run the correct spring depending on what your idle vacuum reading is. Read about it here.

Check your vacuum at idle, refer to the chart, then check the spring you have installed. Let us know how it works out.

 

[5OF2k]

"Cliff Notes:
GET THE TIAL Q BOV WITH THE BLACK SPRING!!!!!
With a correctly operating BOV, On/Off throttle response is much better. No audible compressor surge. Full open venting at idle. No more smoke from the turbo seals between shifts or decel. Still holding strong @ 21psi."

^^ Exactly what I was talking about, thanks for posting the link!

You can see why that would cause an issue on a factory MAS airflow vehicle like ours cars, because that in effect creates a "vacuum leak" or un-metered air to be present, throwing off the ECUs idle fuel tables and so-on. Switching to SD or a GM MAF/trans setup in the proper position would not only get you more power but also eliminate the "vacuum leak" and allow the car to run/idle as intended.

-Jake

 

[DynastyLCD]

very interesting. i've been running my cars for years on the unpainted springs. barely any surge, but it stays shut at idle. still opens up fine.

 

[5OF2k]

Every car is different given its vacuum at idle and so on. Here at over 6kft elevation im pulling only 8in vacuum with my 272s. I have the black and the unpainted spring. The car had the unpainted in it when i got it, but it would only open when returning to vacuum after hitting full boost(26psi)and nothing below that. Switched to the black spring and its been fine ever since, just baaaaaaarely open at idle like its supposed to be. Much better, and no more compressor surge over 10psi or so.

-Jake

 

[DynastyLCD]

i think i might have to try the black spring, Jake. although the only time i get any noticable surge is when its cold as sh*t first thing in the AM. with the 6152 pushing behind it, the tial opens fully after 5 psi and 3500 RPM's. anything below those two, it surges a bit and then opens. FWIW, im at almost sea level down here in CT but i'm making only about -10 vacuum on 272's.

- Phil

 

[5OF2k]

FWIW, surge is really only an issue above about 10psi. Even on a stock uncrushed 1g BOV you'll see surge until around 8-10psi. Even with the black spring id still see slight surge until around 8psi or so. Nothin horrendous, of course.

Just food for thought!

-Jake

 

[DynastyLCD]

summary in relation to my situation: don't even bother with the black spring. lol

dearly noted!

- Phil