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Help with meth/water injection


vr4hotness
New Daddy
436/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212388 posted 07/15/15 11:12 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Well I'm finally getting ready for my tune
150k stock original motor
272/272 delta regrind cams
Ets fmic
880 pe injector
Walbro 255 rewire
Evo8 maf
Evo3 turbo
Downpipe catless
3glifters
Catback exhaust
Original head gasket I think??
Aem tru boost

I have dsmlink and about to get my tune and I got stopped cause I got a ton of interest in methanol injection

This is the kit I was looking at click


Do you guys think it is worth the extra money and power to go meth on this car since we have piss gas 91 in California

This car is not a daily driver and will only see about 3-5 track/autox a year


Not even sure what psi to run and what power I will make



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prove_it
my racist jokes aren't actually funny
715/1000
1284/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212390 posted 07/15/15 11:26 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
The REAL Evo 3 16g will net you a MAX of around 380whp. You will need meth to achieve this with 91 octane pump gas. Without meth you'll probably end up in the 300-330whp range. This is only when running 22psi+. With 150k on the engine though, you'll be fighting worn rings and pistons(not to mention carbon buildup).

If I were you, I'd focus less on maxing out that turbo, and spend money on the engine. At least replace the head gasket and use ARP's and clean up any carbon on the piston surfaces. (carbon will cause knock if there is enough)

Also, is E85 an option? In my opinion alcohol is a better way to go than METH.

Have you at least done a compression test to determine if your engine is ready for this? 150k is a lot of miles for a bone stock turbo engine.



#1284/2K NB, Totaled
#715/1K KG, Rebuilding
02 Acura TL daily duty unit

12yr+ Vr4 owner.
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vr4hotness
New Daddy
436/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212393 posted 07/15/15 11:48 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Ya compression was 154 across all 4

Not a big fan of e85.


That's why I was think just get a tune and call it a day with the current mods


No way in telling if my head gasket has been changed without taking the head off either correct



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Coltsfan
Member
631/1000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212395 posted 07/15/15 11:53 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I run the CMGS progressive gauge/controller with an EIII16g turbo on FIC650s and an extra 10psi of fuel pressure on 93 pump gas and 25psi of boost. It pulls like a wild banshee, and when I run race gas I screw the boost controller down until it bottoms out.

I can't say anything bad about water/meth, as long as you keep the tank full, and power it off during boost leak tests.



92 Galant Vr4 631/1000 ---------DD well on it's way to having new everything...
90 AWD Colt Hatchback ----------Fun car
51 Buick Special ---------------Boring car

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prove_it
my racist jokes aren't actually funny
715/1000
1284/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212398 posted 07/15/15 12:27 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
How can you NOT be fan of E85? Cheap race gas from the pump. I mean come on. No meth tank to fill, helps american farmers, promotes better emissions, I mean come on.



#1284/2K NB, Totaled
#715/1K KG, Rebuilding
02 Acura TL daily duty unit

12yr+ Vr4 owner.
Honda/Acura master tech.
Family Guy

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Coltsfan
Member
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212400 posted 07/15/15 12:37 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I'm not a fan either. Sure it has it's good point, (cheap race fuel) but I'm not buying into all the other "benefits". I refuse to drink the cool aid.



92 Galant Vr4 631/1000 ---------DD well on it's way to having new everything...
90 AWD Colt Hatchback ----------Fun car
51 Buick Special ---------------Boring car


Edited by Coltsfan (07/15/15 12:38 PM)

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prove_it
my racist jokes aren't actually funny
715/1000
1284/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212406 posted 07/15/15 01:42 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
There is 15yrs of research, not to mention my own huge array of personal experience. 5yrs with my stock fuel lines and have yet to "eat" them up.

Remember all the anti-ethanol theories and propaganda come out of the mouths of big oil. Obviously they don't want to lose some of their market. A bit bias if you ask me.

It's much easier to work with than meth.......



#1284/2K NB, Totaled
#715/1K KG, Rebuilding
02 Acura TL daily duty unit

12yr+ Vr4 owner.
Honda/Acura master tech.
Family Guy

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MellowVR4
5" too short
372/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212415 posted 07/15/15 03:22 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I've got meth on mine, Im liking it so far. I've up the boost without being tuned with the meth and no knock! running 22psi on a 60 trim.



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vr4hotness
New Daddy
436/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212417 posted 07/15/15 03:30 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
It's looking like meth would be a waste with a little evo3 turbo, I just want reliable power. And with 150k now I'm getting worried lol



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MellowVR4
5" too short
372/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212418 posted 07/15/15 03:38 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
When I was just running 93 with my big 16g with 750cc, I made 305whp with 17psi, wish I could've gotten more but the wastegate wasn't keeping up.



89 RAIDER V6 5speed
90 GALANT GSX SOLD
91 372/2000 making it pretty again
91 578/2000 sold
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87 4RUNNER LS400 SWAP SOLD:(

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EMX5636
Carbon Fiber Cage
108/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212419 posted 07/15/15 03:39 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Don't be worried about 150k. I ran 30-31psi through my Eclipse for a few years with a T3/TO4e back in the day with water/alky injection at 147k miles. I love water/meth or alky, even with a smaller turbo like that it will help. Esp being able to add a bit of timing and cool off the air the little hairdryer is pushing. I have mine setup to turn on via DSMLink and AUXmaps. Then I can turn it on and off and adjust my boost accordingly to run straight pump gas 90% of the time just driving around.

You can buy a complete kit, but I am usually not a fan of progressive style controllers. I always pieced together a kit, and used a simple Hobbs switch to activate it in the past. Now with DSMlink, you can have it turn on at specific load points (more accurate but still correlates to boost), but off between NLTS, under a certain speed (like while spinning when launching), etc. It's great.



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MellowVR4
5" too short
372/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212421 posted 07/15/15 03:42 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Yeah I have the devils own kit with the controller, works great!



89 RAIDER V6 5speed
90 GALANT GSX SOLD
91 372/2000 making it pretty again
91 578/2000 sold
92 417/1000 DIED
87 4RUNNER LS400 SWAP SOLD:(

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vr4hotness
New Daddy
436/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212437 posted 07/15/15 06:45 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
No way in telling if my head gasket was ever changed huh??

I can tell I've had cams before and they did upgrade my lifters but not sure on the head gasket



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EMX5636
Carbon Fiber Cage
108/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212438 posted 07/15/15 07:13 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
You probably can't tell if it was changed with an OEM composite. But if it's an MLS (multi-layer steel) gasket, you can see it where it sticks out of the side a bit near the #4 exhaust runner. Should be a little tab sticking out. Sorry I don't have any pics available right now, but if you Google MLS and Composite head gasket, you will see the difference. If it's an MLS already, you're fine with running some high boost. Composite can take it as well, but a little less forgiving to detonation and lifting of the head.



91 #108/2000- link
97 Kawi ZX7R Street / 03 ZX6R Track
03 Kawi KLX400R Supermoto
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09 Hummer H3T

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vr4hotness
New Daddy
436/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212439 posted 07/15/15 07:14 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Thank you, gonna look right now



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vr4hotness
New Daddy
436/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212441 posted 07/15/15 07:29 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Well kinda dirty down there lol, but looks like there is a 3 layer metal gasket



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EMX5636
Carbon Fiber Cage
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212442 posted 07/15/15 07:35 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Good news for you. With 155 compression, a MLS and a good tune, you shouldn't have any problems pushing that 16G.



91 #108/2000- link
97 Kawi ZX7R Street / 03 ZX6R Track
03 Kawi KLX400R Supermoto
05 CTS-V
09 Hummer H3T

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vr4hotness
New Daddy
436/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212445 posted 07/15/15 08:14 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Lol

So does that mean mybhead gasket has been changed?

It 3 layers and looks to be metal



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Edited by vr4hotness (07/15/15 08:30 PM)

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turbowop
Hard Snarker
1051/2000



Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212476 posted 07/16/15 12:01 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting vr4hotness:

It's looking like meth would be a waste with a little evo3 turbo, I just want reliable power. And with 150k now I'm getting worried lol




It won't be a waste. You can turn up boost or timing to make more power.

I've been running methanol on my car since '06. With a stock shortblock that has 140k miles on it. Just the headgasket and studs have been changed and that was only because I burned a valve in '03 running too lean on racegas.

E85 is great stuff. But the nearest and ONLY station nearby to me is 35 miles away. Eff that.



-Mark

A face only a grocery shopper could love.
1051

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EMX5636
Carbon Fiber Cage
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212480 posted 07/16/15 08:03 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting vr4hotness:

Lol

So does that mean mybhead gasket has been changed?

It 3 layers and looks to be metal




Yes, they didn't come factory with them in any USDM 4G63 application before the Evo.

And I agree with Mark. I've been running a water/meth or alcohol systems since like 04-05. Works great in almost any application. E85 is the new bandwagon, but there aren't any stations near me with it, and I'm not filling 55gal drums for a daily street car. No way, no how.



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97 Kawi ZX7R Street / 03 ZX6R Track
03 Kawi KLX400R Supermoto
05 CTS-V
09 Hummer H3T

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vr4hotness
New Daddy
436/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212492 posted 07/16/15 09:58 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Thank you guys so much.


I plan on running that cooling mist trunk mount system and get the tune.that same one turbo tom had done to his vr4



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EMX5636
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212555 posted 07/16/15 08:14 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
As much as I love trunk mounted items, I like having all the meth stuff under the hood. If you have ditched ABS, there is plenty of room up behind the drivers headlight for a tank and pump down below. I can take some pics of my setup if you want. I ran the pump and reservoir under the back seat of my Eclipse, cut the foam underneath to fit it, and then you could still sit back there in the outer seats. Just had a filler cap sticking up in the middle seat.



91 #108/2000- link
97 Kawi ZX7R Street / 03 ZX6R Track
03 Kawi KLX400R Supermoto
05 CTS-V
09 Hummer H3T

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vr4hotness
New Daddy
436/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212566 posted 07/16/15 10:35 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Ya post some pictures please.


I still got my abs



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strokin4dr
fighting them with a large needle
1280/2000
1135/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212567 posted 07/16/15 10:42 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting prove_it:

There is 15yrs of research, not to mention my own huge array of personal experience. 5yrs with my stock fuel lines and have yet to "eat" them up.

Remember all the anti-ethanol theories and propaganda come out of the mouths of big oil. Obviously they don't want to lose some of their market. A bit bias if you ask me.

It's much easier to work with than meth.......




I love running E85. That said, I've only been using it in my VR4 since December and this past weekend upgraded my fuel filter to an E85 friendly setup. Decided to pull the fuel rail and inspect everything while things were apart. I was shocked to see that the inside of my rail has a "flakey and pealing" look to it. I inspected the rail prior to installing the larger injectors and flex fuel sensor back in December.
Needless to say I have an anodized rail going back in. The fuel filter I chose is the Fuelab fiberglass 6 micron filter.

I have read horror stories about E85 and not given them much validity myself, hence running ethanol with near factory fuel system. I now can see firsthand what E85 can do to bare aluminum. I'm glad I caught it when I did before anything ended up in my new injectors.

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vr4hotness
New Daddy
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1212570 posted 07/16/15 11:19 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post   
I herd about that also



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