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Advice on torquing exhaust manifold bolt that keeps loosening (Stripped Threads)

467

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2001
Messages
919
Location
Fremont Ca
No. If the safety wire is done properly it will keep the nut from loosening. I doubt you will have as good a luck with a lock washer as with safety wire. The heat will expand and contract that too, as well as weaken it over time.
 

prove_it

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 3, 2008
Messages
4,201
Location
Sioux Falls, SD
No more safety wire talk. Geez. A lock washer with a regular washer is all that's needed.
 

FlyingEagle

Staff member
Joined
Mar 5, 2005
Messages
1,635
Location
THE Ottawa
So, I don't think I have seen a comment concerning self locking copper nuts or similar style nut with different metallurgy, that were all tightened in a center to outside sequence, using a proper torque wrench.

I installed the copper self locking (read - three point pinched, or two point pinched) nuts, which are commercially available at any automotive parts supplier,

or online car parts source. I haven't had one back out yet.

My last install, with a 2G manifold using 1G stock studs, meant I have just enough stud to mate to the nuts, without any threads of the nuts not being swallowed into the nut for locking purposes.

I did have enough room to get my digital torque wrench (ala Snap-on) into the appropriate places, using the shortest possible extensions to keep things relatively close to spec when being tightened.

I had to make between 8 and 18 passes before the three layer MLS Mitsu gasket, would deform/sit fully crushed and the nuts would not set off the buzz and beep

function (also checking my readout screen for exact torque on the fly as it dials in) with a large turn indicating things were still settling in.


Used manifold can take a while to torque down.

I realize that you don't have this sort of access, so if crows feet or extensions must be used, judgement once again comes into play.

I have not had stainless washers (flat) and copper lock washers ever back out, when torqued with either a swing bar torque wrench or an accurate digital torque wrench.

If your manifold is torqued down in less than 3 passes, I would back everything off and do it all at one time, IF possible, again.

These are the nuts I ordered, and yes, I should have installed longer studs, to accommodate a washer going in between everything, but that is where my parts lay in front of me, and I wasn't turning back. Many factory manifolds are installed with a nut, and no washer. Ask me how I know ...

click

FSM manual listings from 1989 show 18-22 FT/LBS, 91-92 GVR4 FSM shows the same.

Click me for GVR4 FSM

Page 589
 
Last edited:

Street Surgeon

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 3, 2004
Messages
941
Location
Omaha, Nebraska
Quoting Street Surgeon:
Use nordlocks, add 20% more tq when tightening (if you can't get a socket or crows foot on it just german gut-n-tight it) and you're done, they won't back off.



Backed off again? but what could be done?!?!? Or go baller with it!
 
Last edited:

Coltsfan

Well-known member
Joined
May 4, 2014
Messages
200
Location
Tonawanda
I run these nuts that I found on a Honda exhaust manifold. They work great.
1-1013-4000%20gy6-exhaust%20stud%20nut%203-448x448.jpg
 

EfiniX

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 18, 2012
Messages
647
Location
portland, or
Mother fuuuu

Ok, so I just got back from Toronto. Drove home from the airport. Drove to dinner. All ok. Drove to an office this morning and the damn nut is loose again. Thank goodness for small miracles... The scribe mark on the end of the exhaust bolt hasn't moved, so the bolt itself isn't running out. But I'm still in a place where I can't get the nut off without cutting the end of the bolt off or loosening every other both and pulling the manifold off the block (which incidentally would also require either moving the radiator or unbolting the exhaust and maybe pulling off the turbo).

I've noticed that their is a washer between the nut and the block surface. This washer is quite smooth on both sides. The nut, however, has teeth on it. Now not every bolt has a washer, but most do...

Can I snip that washer off and just tighten the nut against the head? I would bet those teeth on the nut would hold on pretty good. My other option is to take a locking washer, cut it, twist it open so it can slide around the bolt, then twist it flat again.

Thoughts? I really don't want to cut the bolt and taking the manifold off isn't going to happen anytime soon.
 

holeshotmoe

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 7, 2005
Messages
1,291
Location
MD
Simple thing is to run another nut on there and use as a jam nut .
If you had one, as Coltsfan said, use the locking nut.
 

EfiniX

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 18, 2012
Messages
647
Location
portland, or
lol. If i could get another nut on, I could take the current one off /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


although it would seem that the cap on the nut is what is keeping it from running completely off. I suppose I could try to put a smaller nut onto the bolt. hell, easy enough to try. I'll report back with my results!
 
Last edited:

EfiniX

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 18, 2012
Messages
647
Location
portland, or
Quoting holeshotmoe:
Simple thing is to run another nut on there and use as a jam nut .
If you had one, as Coltsfan said, use the locking nut.



Winner!

Two days and no issue. The jam nut had no cap and was half the size of the existing bolt. It cleared the JNZ manifold by a hair, but it cleared it and ran onto the bolt with ease.

All seems well so far!
 

prove_it

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 3, 2008
Messages
4,201
Location
Sioux Falls, SD
Now just need to clean up and fix the oil seep.....

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 

EfiniX

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 18, 2012
Messages
647
Location
portland, or
an artifact of my old valve cover seal. I'll get it wiped off and retake the picture.

although I do have a crush washer that needs replacing on my turbo oil feed..
 

FlyingEagle

Staff member
Joined
Mar 5, 2005
Messages
1,635
Location
THE Ottawa
Glad to see things are holding up.

Question:

Are the nuts holding the manifold in place, a self locking style?
 

EfiniX

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 18, 2012
Messages
647
Location
portland, or
no, they are not self-locking.
 

EfiniX

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 18, 2012
Messages
647
Location
portland, or
Turns out the that the nut wasn't loosening. The stud was pulling the head threads right out. I pulled the manifold with EHMotorsports and he drilled out the stud holes that we didn't tap during the engine build, then we H-coiled them, and put it all back together with fancy BMW copper stud nuts.

All good now!

And how great is EHMotorsports, huh?
 

EfiniX

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Joined
Oct 18, 2012
Messages
647
Location
portland, or
Fixed

 
Last edited:

coyotes

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Joined
Nov 15, 2013
Messages
1,544
Location
Seattle, WA
I should check mine out since I've been putting some miles on mine. I used copper nuts though.
 

EfiniX

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 18, 2012
Messages
647
Location
portland, or
Check for tightness, sure, but bear in mind that the issue I was having is that the threads in the head pulled right out with the stud. I knew that was the case because I scribed the end of the stud and was able to confirm that even with the nut getting lose, the stud wasn't rotating.

And pro-tip. Pull the manifold and turbo out as one piece. Breaking turbo bolts is soooo easy to do.
 

ghostinthevr4

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 11, 2008
Messages
587
Location
Fresno, Califonia
If I was you I would plan another project and make a hard upper intercooler pipe. That silicon fitting is going to melt over time, it's just a matter of time I hope your car is SD when it happens.

Glad you got the other problem fixed.
 

prove_it

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 3, 2008
Messages
4,201
Location
Sioux Falls, SD
Wha...

Silicone couplers melt? Are you serious?
 
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