tektic
Well-known member
I needed Evo tops for my springs to seat right. Sure your not missing a piece? Also fender rolling seems inevitable.
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Need to RAISE my VR4 in the rear, what are my options?
- Thread starterBrandonEchols
- Start date
cheekychimp
Well-known member
I just spoke to Ken (my mechanic) and the struts definitely will not work in the stock configuration ... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif sorry!
Sounds to me like it is either a strut top or spring perch issue (sorry my Cantonese doesn't quite stretch that far). I will be seeing him tomorrow so I will try to get a proper explanation and maybe some pictures. He said coilovers that allow you to alter ride height without altering spring tension may alleviate the problem as could a strut spacer as previously mentioned. However in order to do the job 'properly' he said that some 'surgery' is required.
I hope I didn't mislead you on this Brandon, stating that everything just bolted up. It turns out that Ken had already had my suspension prepared prior to the rear subframe swap so everything just bolted on. I never even knew it had been altered.
Sounds to me like it is either a strut top or spring perch issue (sorry my Cantonese doesn't quite stretch that far). I will be seeing him tomorrow so I will try to get a proper explanation and maybe some pictures. He said coilovers that allow you to alter ride height without altering spring tension may alleviate the problem as could a strut spacer as previously mentioned. However in order to do the job 'properly' he said that some 'surgery' is required.
I hope I didn't mislead you on this Brandon, stating that everything just bolted up. It turns out that Ken had already had my suspension prepared prior to the rear subframe swap so everything just bolted on. I never even knew it had been altered.
CutlassJim
Well-known member
Holy crap! I just looked at a bunch of images on Google and #5 on my list is what changed. The lower strut mounting point is WAY lower on a 3000GT arm than on a DSM. So you're going to need a longer strut assembly buddy.
CutlassJim
Well-known member
Not the best angle for the DSM one but you can see that the mounting stud is only a few inches lower than the hub centerline
Here is a 3000GT arm with a MUCH lower mounting point.
Here is a 3000GT arm with a MUCH lower mounting point.
cheekychimp
Well-known member
On my car. Not a terribly good pic, I took it to show Dasith the 4-bolt but you can see the mounting point in relation to the hub.
CutlassJim
Well-known member
That is a stock trailing arm correct?
cheekychimp
Well-known member
Stock as in stock VR4 or stock 3KGT?
CutlassJim
Well-known member
Stock as in stock to the car we are talking about. (Galant)
cheekychimp
Well-known member
Well I didn't think so until you mentioned it. That photo is from the grey car. As I recall that was a straight swap of the entire 3KGT trailing arms with hubs and all. The black car was a bit more complicated because we stayed 4-lug.
I know what you are talking about though, that mounting point doesn't look much lower does it? I'll have another look see under the car tomorrow and confirm that for you.
These are old pics of the swap on the black car.
Do these shed any light?
I know what you are talking about though, that mounting point doesn't look much lower does it? I'll have another look see under the car tomorrow and confirm that for you.
These are old pics of the swap on the black car.
Do these shed any light?
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cheekychimp
Well-known member
Right,
I just got back from the shop. Good news and bad news. First of all this thread has a lot of information that is relevant. I was trying to find it last night with the search function and couldn't then remembered I had it saved in my favourite threads list.
3000gt trailing arm install with 4WS and ABS etc
It pretty much states on page two that adjustable height suspension or longer struts are required with non-modified 3KGT arms.
IF you want to keep your EVO struts there is a solution that DOES NOT require any modification to the struts. The bad news is it requires modification of the 3KGT trailing arms. Cutlass Jim threw me last night when he suggested the trailing arms on my grey car were stock VR4 arms. I knew that they weren't because the only real reason to do this swap is to use 3KGT rear hubs with the drum e-brake assembly (hence the 3KGT trailing arms). But when I looked at all my photos of the trailing arms for both the grey car and the black car, the suspension mount looked to be in the same position as the DSM/VR4.
When Ken told me last night that the suspension mounts had to be raised to make this work I thought he meant adjusting the spring perches or top mounts. In fact he was talking about that lower mount. He doesn't modify the suspension or use longer struts (although he says that does work). Instead he cuts the VR4/DSM mount off the stock arm and welds it on to the 3KGT arm to give it identical mounting points/geometry to the VR4 one.
This is what amazes me about Ken. He does stuff like this and does it so well it is hard to even see it without very close inspection and yet I ask him to put aftermarket cams in my car and he says he would rather not because he knows I'm picky about my idle and says he's not confident about getting the overlap right /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif
So at least you have an answer Brandon. Either change/modify your struts or modify the trailing arm.
I just got back from the shop. Good news and bad news. First of all this thread has a lot of information that is relevant. I was trying to find it last night with the search function and couldn't then remembered I had it saved in my favourite threads list.
3000gt trailing arm install with 4WS and ABS etc
It pretty much states on page two that adjustable height suspension or longer struts are required with non-modified 3KGT arms.
IF you want to keep your EVO struts there is a solution that DOES NOT require any modification to the struts. The bad news is it requires modification of the 3KGT trailing arms. Cutlass Jim threw me last night when he suggested the trailing arms on my grey car were stock VR4 arms. I knew that they weren't because the only real reason to do this swap is to use 3KGT rear hubs with the drum e-brake assembly (hence the 3KGT trailing arms). But when I looked at all my photos of the trailing arms for both the grey car and the black car, the suspension mount looked to be in the same position as the DSM/VR4.
When Ken told me last night that the suspension mounts had to be raised to make this work I thought he meant adjusting the spring perches or top mounts. In fact he was talking about that lower mount. He doesn't modify the suspension or use longer struts (although he says that does work). Instead he cuts the VR4/DSM mount off the stock arm and welds it on to the 3KGT arm to give it identical mounting points/geometry to the VR4 one.
This is what amazes me about Ken. He does stuff like this and does it so well it is hard to even see it without very close inspection and yet I ask him to put aftermarket cams in my car and he says he would rather not because he knows I'm picky about my idle and says he's not confident about getting the overlap right /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif
So at least you have an answer Brandon. Either change/modify your struts or modify the trailing arm.
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BrandonEchols
Well-known member
So much for this being a direct bolt up mod. My own fault for not measuring the parts before I put it all in place, but this isn't the news I wanted. It's all got to come apart again and get welded on. I don't trust spacers to something like this, plus if I want to change suspension in the future, it'd be nice to not have to space or modify each set of struts. Looks like it's back into the garage, with me, I might kill myself by the time this is over, already super frustrated with it at this point.
Thanks for the help everyone, particularly Paul and Jim.
GSTwithPSI
Well-known member
Will coilovers not give you the amount of adjustment required?
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fuel
Well-known member
Quoting cheekychimp:
Right,
I just got back from the shop. Good news and bad news. First of all this thread has a lot of information that is relevant. I was trying to find it last night with the search function and couldn't then remembered I had it saved in my favourite threads list.
3000gt trailing arm install with 4WS and ABS etc
It pretty much states on page two that adjustable height suspension or longer struts are required with non-modified 3KGT arms.
IF you want to keep your EVO struts there is a solution that DOES NOT require any modification to the struts. The bad news is it requires modification of the 3KGT trailing arms. Cutlass Jim threw me last night when he suggested the trailing arms on my grey car were stock VR4 arms. I knew that they weren't because the only real reason to do this swap is to use 3KGT rear hubs with the drum e-brake assembly (hence the 3KGT trailing arms). But when I looked at all my photos of the trailing arms for both the grey car and the black car, the suspension mount looked to be in the same position as the DSM/VR4.
When Ken told me last night that the suspension mounts had to be raised to make this work I thought he meant adjusting the spring perches or top mounts. In fact he was talking about that lower mount. He doesn't modify the suspension or use longer struts (although he says that does work). Instead he cuts the VR4/DSM mount off the stock arm and welds it on to the 3KGT arm to give it identical mounting points/geometry to the VR4 one.
This is what amazes me about Ken. He does stuff like this and does it so well it is hard to even see it without very close inspection and yet I ask him to put aftermarket cams in my car and he says he would rather not because he knows I'm picky about my idle and says he's not confident about getting the overlap right /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif
So at least you have an answer Brandon. Either change/modify your struts or modify the trailing arm.
It's possible your rear trailing arms are from an E26A Diamante - they are a mix of VR-4/DSM and 3kGT. They have the 5 lug with internal hand brake of the 3kGT but have the higher pine height and same pin diameter as the VR-4.
Right,
I just got back from the shop. Good news and bad news. First of all this thread has a lot of information that is relevant. I was trying to find it last night with the search function and couldn't then remembered I had it saved in my favourite threads list.
3000gt trailing arm install with 4WS and ABS etc
It pretty much states on page two that adjustable height suspension or longer struts are required with non-modified 3KGT arms.
IF you want to keep your EVO struts there is a solution that DOES NOT require any modification to the struts. The bad news is it requires modification of the 3KGT trailing arms. Cutlass Jim threw me last night when he suggested the trailing arms on my grey car were stock VR4 arms. I knew that they weren't because the only real reason to do this swap is to use 3KGT rear hubs with the drum e-brake assembly (hence the 3KGT trailing arms). But when I looked at all my photos of the trailing arms for both the grey car and the black car, the suspension mount looked to be in the same position as the DSM/VR4.
When Ken told me last night that the suspension mounts had to be raised to make this work I thought he meant adjusting the spring perches or top mounts. In fact he was talking about that lower mount. He doesn't modify the suspension or use longer struts (although he says that does work). Instead he cuts the VR4/DSM mount off the stock arm and welds it on to the 3KGT arm to give it identical mounting points/geometry to the VR4 one.
This is what amazes me about Ken. He does stuff like this and does it so well it is hard to even see it without very close inspection and yet I ask him to put aftermarket cams in my car and he says he would rather not because he knows I'm picky about my idle and says he's not confident about getting the overlap right /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif
So at least you have an answer Brandon. Either change/modify your struts or modify the trailing arm.
It's possible your rear trailing arms are from an E26A Diamante - they are a mix of VR-4/DSM and 3kGT. They have the 5 lug with internal hand brake of the 3kGT but have the higher pine height and same pin diameter as the VR-4.
Well now you tell us. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
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cheekychimp
Well-known member
Quoting fuel:
It's possible your rear trailing arms are from an E26A Diamante - they are a mix of VR-4/DSM and 3kGT. They have the 5 lug with internal hand brake of the 3kGT but have the higher pine height and same pin diameter as the VR-4.
Well, I don't think mine are, after going through it all with Ken the other day, but like iceman said, that's one hell of a revelation. Where were these cars available? Any chance Brandon would find one over there, or that I'd get one in Hong Kong for that matter?
It's possible your rear trailing arms are from an E26A Diamante - they are a mix of VR-4/DSM and 3kGT. They have the 5 lug with internal hand brake of the 3kGT but have the higher pine height and same pin diameter as the VR-4.
Well, I don't think mine are, after going through it all with Ken the other day, but like iceman said, that's one hell of a revelation. Where were these cars available? Any chance Brandon would find one over there, or that I'd get one in Hong Kong for that matter?
EMX5636
Well-known member
Paul, I'm pretty sure you had told me that at least one of your cars was Diamante arms. It was probably in a thread or PM's years ago. If it wasn't you, I definitely recall that conversation with someone on here. That was one of the main reasons I didn't do the swap and just eliminated the active toe on my stock arms, were it wasn't worth me doing it unless I could find the Diamante arms that are truly bolt on.
Is E26 the first gen diamante? That makes sense as that car and the 3kgt were the same platform.
fuel
Well-known member
It was RedTwo in New Zealand who used the Diamante arms. The F26A was sold in Japan and New Zealand. I Came across one at a U-pull style wrecking yard when I was in Auckland NZ last week. It was such a nice car and looked complete with no damage when it came in. My bet is the auto trans failed and they just junked it.
cheekychimp
Well-known member
E26A or F26A?
Not being pedantic /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif but you mentioned both.
Not being pedantic /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif but you mentioned both.
I think F is correct. I have to look on CAPS.
