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been theory crafting a build for a while now....

VR_IV_MR

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Dec 4, 2007
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283
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Queens, NY
and the problem is I am still confused about certain things. I have read countless threads on any topic I could think of and have emailed numerous vendors/gurus/gearheads/friends/mechanics about things that I needed clarification on. I am at a point where certain details of my build have to be ironed out, but for the most part I have a good idea of what i want 591/2k to be. I have been acquiring parts and doing minor and major maintenance things to the car over the past few years, but this year I am going to go a little crazy. Im sorry if my thoughts jump around.

So I am 100% certain I want to switch to automatic trans. The question becomes 1g or 2g auto trans-- as of right now it seems 1g is the easier way out especially since I have seen a few members on here with a 1g auto in their galant. However I have read that the 2g auto is better, but I don't feel like looking for that thread right now. I think the decision is going to come down to the aftermarket support for the converters. Just mentioning it so I remember to check on this later.

I plan on running the Borg Warner EFR 8374 turbo with twin Tial 44mm wastegates and the 1.05 AR. A 4" intake pipe into the 4" compressor inlet. 2.5" compressor outlet direct to 2.5" intercooler piping, through a q45 throttle body and the magnus v3 cast intake manifold. GSC S2 cams. JMF top mount divided exhaust manifold, 3" vband from turbine outlet all the way through to the 3" muffler tip. I will be running 93 octane to start. Eventually I MIGHT run 93+meth, or e85, but that is for the future to tell.

When it comes to the engine build I have two options in mind. My goal is to create an engine/turbo setup that will NOT need juice to get up on the stall, hence the 2 stroker options here:

Eagle 94mm crank
Manley 150mm TT rods
CP 94mm stroker pistons 9.0:1

or

Eagle 100mm crank
Manley 150mm TT rods
Wiseco 1400HD pistons 10.0:1

With the 94mm setup I am stuck with a 9.0:1 compression ratio whereas with the 2.3L kit ups it to 10:1. Now what concerns me about the CP setup is that the CP pistons will not be as forgiving as the proven wiseco pistons. The only thing that makes me lean towards the CP setup is the better rod ratio for less stress on the internals. So what would be better (performance aside)... less stress on internals, or stronger pistons? Would the CP setup last longer given everything is ok due to the better rod ratio? On the other hand will the CP fail faster if I happen to have a tuning error? Having gone through two engines already, the reputation that the HD wiseco's have of being able to withstand abuse is attractive, I could care less about saving a few grams on my pistons. However I don't want an engine that is only going to last 40k miles. What is the life expectancy on these stroker engines anyway? I can only find threads from 2002 about this which must be outdated.


Is a Walbro 400lph and FIC Bluemax 1650's good enough for this setup with 93 octane? with e85?


This will be tuned on speed density with ecmlink v3.



Would 1.25" diameter runners in the exhaust manifold make sense in this application to help build pressure on the converter when launching, or will these smaller runners hurt this turbo up top too much?
 

prove_it

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Good planning.

On your fuel you may want to plan bigger for e85. That turbo is rated for 79lbs/min. I would plan on going with 2000cc or bigger injectors. I'm not familiar with the pump. Wish I could help more.
 

DR1665

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Iowa City, IA
That's quite the detailed and thoughtful post, sir. One question I would ask is: What are your goals? Near-term, long-term?
 

tektic

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Dec 19, 2012
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ronkonkoma, ny
check out the manley catalog i think they have a 9.5 and 10:1 for the 94mm crank.... been a while not sure but my pistons are 9:1 manley with 150mm rods.
 

VR_IV_MR

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Messages
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Queens, NY
ok so i think 1650cc should be good enough based on that chart


a little udpate I have just recently completed the following. I had a stuck caliper so I took care of that. 3" turbo back exhaust with a vibrant resonator thrown on. catch can. ETS FMIC kit. 63mm bored NT throttle body. All front/rear subframe bushings have been replaced. jay racing toe eliminator. removed the abs equipment. new power steering rack. threw on the tein HA coilovers and not too happy with how comfortable the car is- I think I will eventually switch to the evo mr bilstein conversion or maybe the 1g ohlins setup because I dont like how the car rides at all.

I think the auto conversion has to wait for next year. And I am going to hold off on the magnus v3 intake manifold and q45 TB for now-maybe if I find a used one for sale ill snatch it. So the goal right now is to get the 94mm eagle crank in there, the gsc s2 cams and headwork, fuel pump, lines, injectors, regulator etc, and the MSD DIS-2 and sparktech COP, and lastly the turbo/manifold section. Prob will do an afco style rad as well.

-call jmf this week to start the exhaust manifold. going with the topmount twin scroll with 1.25" runners instead of the 1.5" that is in the specs on their website
-call shearer to get a set of custom wiseco hd2 pistons
-call mike @ r&r to get 153mm rods

once i get in these 3 parts I will order the rest of the scrap metal



my goal is to kick ass and have fun. i also dont want to leave anything on the table if i am going to spend all this money. gt35 sized turbo just seems to be the largest that makes sense so I am going to start there instead of having the thought in the back of my mind that I didn't get the bigger one.
 

alansupra94

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I will be heading down this road possibly in the summer. I will be going with a Holset HE451VE and a VGT controller. Should be interesting.
 

thecman02

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Kalamazoo,MI
My only concern is the 1650CC injectors are low Z. Those thing are known to be a bitch to tune on pump gas.
 

prove_it

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The e85 chart listed above is running the injectors at 12:1 fuel ratio. With the GT35 I've seen good results at 11.5:1. You'll still make huge power and it's safer. If you go that way your injectors will max out. I do not recommend running E85 injectors past the 80% IDC line. Just looking out for ya, not putting anyone down. I would step up higher to keep yourself in the safe range.
 
Last edited:

VR_IV_MR

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Queens, NY
OK cool so after a little searching it seems like the injector dynAmics id2000 is the way to go for injectors that maintain idle and part throttle normal characteristics yet still handle a gt35 sized turbo


Thanks for that.

As for the wiseco hd2 pistons, shearer has yet to get back to me and I spoke to one of the vendors on dsmlink but he confused me in his reply so I am waiting for clarification on these pistons. Supposedly the valve relief is backwards because the hd2 piston is designed for the evo head. Apparently shearer can have them made correct for a DSM head... but we shall see...
 

prove_it

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Buddy of mine runs 800+whp in his talon with JE pistons and hasn't had an issue yet. He runs E98 though.
 

alansupra94

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I can tell you from experience that JE pistons are very strong BUT if not clearanced correctly, can suffer from piston slap.

I already have some 1600cc injectors so I was planning to run it and see where I stand before getting some Bosch EV14. Just so you know FIC and ID are just Bosch injectors.
 

VR_IV_MR

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OK so basically the 2.2L setup is going to take approx 8 weeks to get the parts in. It will also cost an extra $600 over the 2.3L build. The R&R rods are about 1200 and the custom Wiseco HD2 from English Racing are 750. Magnus recommends a 9500rpm rev limit for their 2.2L so I will shift it at 9-9.2 to be safe. I hope to see full boost (30-32psi) at 4.7k and hold it out to 9.2. That would be 4500 rpm of powerband.
 

VR_IV_MR

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Do you think the powerband with the 2.2L and the EFR 8374 (79 lbs/min) will be too peaky and not fun/potentially unsafe for daily driving? Should I just go with a 7670 (64 lbs/min)? Won't the 7670 start to fall off close to 7k rpm? Wouldn't that defeat the purpose of the 2.2L stroker with the 9k rpm rev limit? Wouldn't the 8374 utilize the 9k rpm better?
 
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