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Help identifying a forged piston.


NateCrisman
Fisheye Hoodpins
418/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770103 posted 03/17/09 01:57 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Hey guys, I have a set of forged pistons that I need some help identifying the brand. There are no markings or ID stamps anywhere, so all I have to go on is "looks". I used to sell Wiseco and Ross pistons, they don't look at all like those. Maybe JE? The rods are crower, so maybe an old-school hint?

They came from the engine I pulled out of GVR4 828. They are 86mm dia at the skirt bottom. The block they were in had some half-ass stuff with welded cracks and orings on the HG surface. So I want to order a new ring set and have a different block bored out for these.

Pics:

yeah, they are a little scuffed. nothing horrible though IMHO.



The piston tops have an odd shape, the quench area doesn't go around to the sides of the piston, only the front/back. I'm used to looking at dsm pistons with a round dish type top.



This #1 piston has some little dimples like a ball got into the cyl, I think I can smooth them out with some sanding/filing.


Im intending to put these unknown pistons, along with the crower rods, knife edged 6B crank, ARP mains and put together a good "built motor" for my personal GVR4. I haven't been able to sell the motor as is, so I might as well use the good internals. Then I can hit it with a 200shot and worry less.

I'm picking up a 1g awd this weekend that needs a shortblock, the stock motor from my gvr4 can go into that car, which is a fix-up-to-resell type car.



GVR4 #418/2000: [email protected] - pump/alky -
GVR4 #431/1000: [email protected]+
GVR4 #139/1000: T3T4: [email protected] - 14B: [email protected] (sold)

www.PerformancePartout.com

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Jonvr4
Unregistered


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770139 posted 03/17/09 03:47 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
They look like they seen some detonation. JEs all have the JE stamp on the inside, so maybe CP?

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NateCrisman
Fisheye Hoodpins
418/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770151 posted 03/17/09 04:18 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Ok so the list of "can't be"
Ross
Wiseco
JE

Can anyone else strike a brand out?



GVR4 #418/2000: [email protected] - pump/alky -
GVR4 #431/1000: [email protected]+
GVR4 #139/1000: T3T4: [email protected] - 14B: [email protected] (sold)

www.PerformancePartout.com

Posts: 2054 | From: Blairstown, NJ | Member Since: 11/22/08 | IP: (32.143.165.237) | Report this post to a Moderator

NateCrisman
Fisheye Hoodpins
418/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770222 posted 03/17/09 07:38 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting Jonvr4:

They look like they seen some detonation. JEs all have the JE stamp on the inside, so maybe CP?




As for detonation, that didn't cause those dimples. There are matching perfectly round impressions in the cyl head that came off this motor, "something round" got into that cyl and bounced around a few times before getting out the exhaust. Seems like a tiny ball bearing or something like that.

The other 3 pistons are perfect on top. The top outer edges are all smooth, normally with detonation issues, the edges are rough.



GVR4 #418/2000: [email protected] - pump/alky -
GVR4 #431/1000: [email protected]+
GVR4 #139/1000: T3T4: [email protected] - 14B: [email protected] (sold)

www.PerformancePartout.com

Posts: 2054 | From: Blairstown, NJ | Member Since: 11/22/08 | IP: (76.6.40.155) | Report this post to a Moderator

Jonvr4
Unregistered


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770223 posted 03/17/09 07:40 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Ross pistons have Ross cast into them, JE's have JE, weisco have coated skirts don't they?

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EMX5636
Carbon Fiber Cage
108/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770225 posted 03/17/09 07:45 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Yeah, def not either of those three... Might be CP or Mahle...



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Jonvr4
Unregistered


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770226 posted 03/17/09 07:49 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Mahle have a phosphate coating I think. They also have a very small skirt, so not Mahle. Arias?

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NateCrisman
Fisheye Hoodpins
418/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770241 posted 03/17/09 08:47 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
CP pistons catalog

After hitting a bunch of mfg websites, I'm thinking they are likely CP pistons.



GVR4 #418/2000: [email protected] - pump/alky -
GVR4 #431/1000: [email protected]+
GVR4 #139/1000: T3T4: [email protected] - 14B: [email protected] (sold)

www.PerformancePartout.com

Posts: 2054 | From: Blairstown, NJ | Member Since: 11/22/08 | IP: (76.6.40.155) | Report this post to a Moderator

Jonvr4
Unregistered


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770244 posted 03/17/09 08:56 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
What do I win?

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3rdstrikedsm
Now mandatory for Wendy's Chili to come with cheese


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770253 posted 03/17/09 09:32 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
That area where the damage is will cause detonation, I would get a replacement for that one.



1994 supra 6spd 612whp and more to come soon!
1995.5 Audi s6 Vi-pec powered!

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NateCrisman
Fisheye Hoodpins
418/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770262 posted 03/17/09 09:59 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
yeah, I think I should be able to sand down those pits without losing much material.



GVR4 #418/2000: [email protected] - pump/alky -
GVR4 #431/1000: [email protected]+
GVR4 #139/1000: T3T4: [email protected] - 14B: [email protected] (sold)

www.PerformancePartout.com

Posts: 2054 | From: Blairstown, NJ | Member Since: 11/22/08 | IP: (76.6.40.155) | Report this post to a Moderator

fivestardsm
"Savior of the damned and dis-owned"


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770281 posted 03/17/09 10:59 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting Jonvr4:

Ross pistons have Ross cast into them, JE's have JE, weisco have coated skirts don't they?




I belive that the older wiseco's did not have the coating on the skirts like they do now.

Unless you are sure that they are CP, you might want to check speed pro (A.K.A. sealed power). The tops look like a set I use to have in a s.b.350 years ago. I have another set of the Speed pro in my Ford 302 and they are coated on the skirts.
You might check Keith black. I know their are more out there, I just cant think of them right now.



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prove_it
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770300 posted 03/17/09 11:58 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I don't think that Mahle prints anything on their pistons, but they dont have that kind of top. If they are CP they must be from a while back. If the engine was still running good, they must be a good brand.


Maybe they were made up in Iceland?



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curtis Galant VR4.org Moderator
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770700 posted 03/19/09 01:53 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Hey Nate looks like we both have the same mystery pistons

click me

I was told mine were CP's only difference I see from yours and mine the sides on the dome are cut out on yours. My guess it was custom to lower the CR down to 8.0 / 7.5 range on yours



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bigblock4g63
Member +


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770739 posted 03/19/09 08:32 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting NateCrisman:

CP pistons catalog

After hitting a bunch of mfg websites, I'm thinking they are likely CP pistons.


i dont think so. cp as a stamp on the bottom





Tuned by Krispeed
Control Flow Porting - books are closed - please contact Curt Brown Racing
Morales Racing
Magnus Motorsports



Edited by bigblock4g63 (03/19/09 08:55 AM)

Posts: 308 | From: new jersey | Member Since: 02/11/09 | IP: (64.12.117.75) | Report this post to a Moderator

NateCrisman
Fisheye Hoodpins
418/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 770856 posted 03/19/09 01:33 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
That pic of a CP piston is all cast/forged rough finish on the inside. My pistons are all smooth machined finish on the inside.

hrm...
the thing that makes me still think CP is there is a groove cut between the top and middle compression rings. CP lists that as a "feature" in thier literature, and Iv not seen anything like that mentioned by another brand.

either way, rings are relatively generic (So I have been told now). Ill measure the existing rings and ring grooves, and have my machine shop make a recomendation to replace them if need be.



GVR4 #418/2000: [email protected] - pump/alky -
GVR4 #431/1000: [email protected]+
GVR4 #139/1000: T3T4: [email protected] - 14B: [email protected] (sold)

www.PerformancePartout.com

Posts: 2054 | From: Blairstown, NJ | Member Since: 11/22/08 | IP: (76.6.40.155) | Report this post to a Moderator

Smitty1457
Unregistered


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 771092 posted 03/20/09 12:39 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Not Mahle's. Thats all i got.

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bigblock4g63
Member +


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 771125 posted 03/20/09 05:19 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting NateCrisman:

That pic of a CP piston is all cast/forged rough finish on the inside. My pistons are all smooth machined finish on the inside.

hrm...
the thing that makes me still think CP is there is a groove cut between the top and middle compression rings. CP lists that as a "feature" in thier literature, and Iv not seen anything like that mentioned by another brand.

either way, rings are relatively generic (So I have been told now). Ill measure the existing rings and ring grooves, and have my machine shop make a recomendation to replace them if need be.






Tuned by Krispeed
Control Flow Porting - books are closed - please contact Curt Brown Racing
Morales Racing
Magnus Motorsports


Posts: 308 | From: new jersey | Member Since: 02/11/09 | IP: (205.188.116.6) | Report this post to a Moderator

bigblock4g63
Member +


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 771126 posted 03/20/09 05:20 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
it could be a srp piston .. they are the lower line of je



Tuned by Krispeed
Control Flow Porting - books are closed - please contact Curt Brown Racing
Morales Racing
Magnus Motorsports



Edited by bigblock4g63 (03/20/09 12:58 PM)

Posts: 308 | From: new jersey | Member Since: 02/11/09 | IP: (205.188.116.6) | Report this post to a Moderator

bigblock4g63
Member +


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 773988 posted 03/26/09 08:01 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
and for the win the piston is a roller wave




Quoting NateCrisman:

Hey guys, I have a set of forged pistons that I need some help identifying the brand. There are no markings or ID stamps anywhere, so all I have to go on is "looks". I used to sell Wiseco and Ross pistons, they don't look at all like those. Maybe JE? The rods are crower, so maybe an old-school hint?

They came from the engine I pulled out of GVR4 828. They are 86mm dia at the skirt bottom. The block they were in had some half-ass stuff with welded cracks and orings on the HG surface. So I want to order a new ring set and have a different block bored out for these.

Pics:

yeah, they are a little scuffed. nothing horrible though IMHO.



The piston tops have an odd shape, the quench area doesn't go around to the sides of the piston, only the front/back. I'm used to looking at dsm pistons with a round dish type top.



This #1 piston has some little dimples like a ball got into the cyl, I think I can smooth them out with some sanding/filing.


Im intending to put these unknown pistons, along with the crower rods, knife edged 6B crank, ARP mains and put together a good "built motor" for my personal GVR4. I haven't been able to sell the motor as is, so I might as well use the good internals. Then I can hit it with a 200shot and worry less.

I'm picking up a 1g awd this weekend that needs a shortblock, the stock motor from my gvr4 can go into that car, which is a fix-up-to-resell type car.






Tuned by Krispeed
Control Flow Porting - books are closed - please contact Curt Brown Racing
Morales Racing
Magnus Motorsports


Posts: 308 | From: new jersey | Member Since: 02/11/09 | IP: (64.12.117.75) | Report this post to a Moderator

NateCrisman
Fisheye Hoodpins
418/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 774123 posted 03/27/09 06:30 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Bigblock is the man! Endyn roller wave pistons. I just emailed them to request a spec sheet.



GVR4 #418/2000: [email protected] - pump/alky -
GVR4 #431/1000: [email protected]+
GVR4 #139/1000: T3T4: [email protected] - 14B: [email protected] (sold)

www.PerformancePartout.com

Posts: 2054 | From: Blairstown, NJ | Member Since: 11/22/08 | IP: (76.6.40.155) | Report this post to a Moderator

NateCrisman
Fisheye Hoodpins
418/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 774143 posted 03/27/09 07:57 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
That sucks, here's the response I got from Endyn when asked for a spec sheet:


Quote:

We're no longer producing the 4G63 pistons, however, I will give you some advice....the machinist MUST have the pistons in-hand for precise measurement before he can bore/hone the cylinders. All pistons vary +/-.0001" in diameter, and each cylinder must be finished for each piston.





GVR4 #418/2000: [email protected] - pump/alky -
GVR4 #431/1000: [email protected]+
GVR4 #139/1000: T3T4: [email protected] - 14B: [email protected] (sold)

www.PerformancePartout.com

Posts: 2054 | From: Blairstown, NJ | Member Since: 11/22/08 | IP: (76.6.40.155) | Report this post to a Moderator

bigblock4g63
Member +


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 774144 posted 03/27/09 07:59 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
i called them and i am waiting for there return call.



Tuned by Krispeed
Control Flow Porting - books are closed - please contact Curt Brown Racing
Morales Racing
Magnus Motorsports


Posts: 308 | From: new jersey | Member Since: 02/11/09 | IP: (64.12.117.75) | Report this post to a Moderator

bigblock4g63
Member +


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 774149 posted 03/27/09 08:04 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting NateCrisman:

That sucks, here's the response I got from Endyn when asked for a spec sheet:


</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
We're no longer producing the 4G63 pistons, however, I will give you some advice....the machinist MUST have the pistons in-hand for precise measurement before he can bore/hone the cylinders. All pistons vary +/-.0001" in diameter, and each cylinder must be finished for each piston.







that sucks. i called them because one of the pistons i have the pin is way off. i am going to have the guy go machine shop.



Tuned by Krispeed
Control Flow Porting - books are closed - please contact Curt Brown Racing
Morales Racing
Magnus Motorsports


Posts: 308 | From: new jersey | Member Since: 02/11/09 | IP: (64.12.117.75) | Report this post to a Moderator

bigblock4g63
Member +


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 774153 posted 03/27/09 08:17 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post   
email from them

I have located the design specs, so we can still make the pistons.
Compression ratio is 9.2-1.
I will need to know the bore diameter you need, as well as your rod's
wrist-pin diameter, as there were two different sizes on those engines.
Price to make the pistons is $505.00 + rings at $125.00.
Larry



Tuned by Krispeed
Control Flow Porting - books are closed - please contact Curt Brown Racing
Morales Racing
Magnus Motorsports


Posts: 308 | From: new jersey | Member Since: 02/11/09 | IP: (64.12.117.75) | Report this post to a Moderator


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