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0 mile refreshed engine different build ideas


Kibby
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1199993 posted 01/28/15 03:36 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I bought a refreshed 6 bolt from craig last year which sat from excessive work hours and procrastination. Its stock minus some cams a metal hg and arp studs. Lately Ive spent time doing more research than actual wrenching on the car. Im pretty much settled on a fp black. Ill be using the fp manifold an evo o2 housing and the usual supporting mods exhaust fmic and such. I dont feel that the stock block will either last long or be able to hold the power of the fp black. My question is since its a 0 mile engine would it be possible to just disassemble the block and swap in a piston and rod combo? Im thinking wisco piston eagle or manley rod setup. Ill get tre to do a stage 3 transmission and ill enjoy the hp til the act clutch cant hold it anymore lol.



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362Ryan
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1199995 posted 01/28/15 04:03 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Throw it in and let it rip. It will hold plenty of power on a good tune.



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prove_it
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1199996 posted 01/28/15 04:08 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Agreed, that is as long as the assembly was properly machined, torqued and put together properly.



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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1199998 posted 01/28/15 04:25 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Most of the entry level after market parts aren't much stronger than the factory stuff. I've been around a bunch of stock motors making 500 whp. Only reason some people change parts is pistons for more compression.



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Kibby
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1199999 posted 01/28/15 04:39 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Yeah this has the s5ock 7.8. That was the other part I figured as far as taking the high boost id like to throw at it. Well f*^k it ill throw it in and if it blows oh well. Its all fun and money. Thanks guys.



As a rule of thumb for the Mitsubishi owner with a desire to go faster "If your car ain't broke, you are"

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LIV4PSI
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200009 posted 01/28/15 05:26 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
My problem is things snowball. Higher compression pistons would be nice, but then you might as well buy forged ones. But aftermarket pistons have different style wrist pins, so might was well buy forged rods. Well, since I doing everything, guess it's time for a 2.3...



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Edited by LIV4PSI (01/28/15 05:26 PM)

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GSTwithPSI
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200011 posted 01/28/15 05:50 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
The cylinders will need a fairly fresh hone if you want the new rings to break in properly. I'd assume this is the case on a zero mile motor, but it's worth mentioning.



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Edited by GSTwithPSI (01/28/15 05:56 PM)

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Kibby
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200014 posted 01/28/15 06:46 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Im just gonna roll with it. I definitely need to replace a few suspension bushings and parts to get it safely driveable aside from going solid bushing. The transmission and transcase will be rebuilt as well as the driveshaft. Im contemplating deleting the ps and ac as its just not going to be a daily as I had in mind in the beginning. I had this idea of until I cant drive the car on the street I want to keep all the goodies. Now I see fully gutting the car and just having the driver seat. Ive already got 2 dailys I switch between and I just need to get in my head that I want function over luxury. I bought this because ive always wanted an evo but this was a much cheaper alternative. So I may have parts for sale at some point. But not until weather breaks as I lack a garage atm lol.



As a rule of thumb for the Mitsubishi owner with a desire to go faster "If your car ain't broke, you are"

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coyotes
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200027 posted 01/28/15 08:11 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
what are your desired boost and power levels? I have pretty much the same setup about to go into my car this year, I only plan on running an hx35 on 25lbs or so. nuthin fancy



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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200029 posted 01/28/15 08:40 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Just keep in mind, if you ever decide you want to get rid of the car, it's going to be hard when it's missing things like the power steering and a full interior. I'd just keep all the comfort items as long as they are still practical. I guess worst case, you could just keep the stuff in the garage or something.

You never go full racecar...Well, at least not until you're installing a cage and out of ways to shave another .01 seconds off a 1/4 mile

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Kibby
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200065 posted 01/29/15 08:47 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting coyotes:

what are your desired boost and power levels? I have pretty much the same setup about to go into my car this year, I only plan on running an hx35 on 25lbs or so. nuthin fancy



I figure somewhere over 9000 lol. Not sure. 4-500 tops. They just got e85 about 20 minutes from my house so it may be closer to the 500. Ive got 1600 injectors so ive got enough there. Ill need a bigger pump though.



As a rule of thumb for the Mitsubishi owner with a desire to go faster "If your car ain't broke, you are"

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Kibby
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200066 posted 01/29/15 08:55 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting GSTwithPSI:

Just keep in mind, if you ever decide you want to get rid of the car, it's going to be hard when it's missing things like the power steering and a full interior. I'd just keep all the comfort items as long as they are still practical. I guess worst case, you could just keep the stuff in the garage or something.

You never go full racecar...Well, at least not until you're installing a cage and out of ways to shave another .01 seconds off a 1/4 mile




At what speed/trap time do I need a cage? I used to have a site that told me all the requirements but cant find it.



As a rule of thumb for the Mitsubishi owner with a desire to go faster "If your car ain't broke, you are"

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LIV4PSI
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200069 posted 01/29/15 09:14 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Helmet at 13.99 or faster
Roll bar at 11.49 or faster
Roll cage at 10.99 or faster (fire jacket as well)
Parachute at 150mph or faster



-Craig
1501 Build Thread


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thruarod
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200538 posted 02/03/15 08:21 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Unless you come to the shitty tracks in Jersey which require a jacket for "non-factory turbo" even if they run 18s



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prove_it
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200540 posted 02/03/15 08:34 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Really? That makes sense....



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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200552 posted 02/03/15 01:07 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I would definitely run the stock engine. Most important part to longevity is having a good tune. Take the money you would have spent on some internals for tuning and related accessories. I'd park the power and torque around 400 and call it a day. Reliability and drive-ability go in the shitter when you go much further.



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Kibby
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200565 posted 02/03/15 04:52 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Thats the thing. drive-ability isnt my concern. I just want to take it to the track and very limited street use. I thought about it most of the winter. I used to have a 300hp 240sx. The car weighed nothing and had no problems getting to 150+mph on the highway. It was fun but expensive. 30k miles over 4 years took its toll on my wallet lol. Id like to make power on pump gas or e85 but I want to go with a larger turbo. Less boost and more power I.e. fp black 400+ should be enough for me.



As a rule of thumb for the Mitsubishi owner with a desire to go faster "If your car ain't broke, you are"

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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200569 posted 02/03/15 05:59 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I'd up that number to 500-550 whp, but I digress. I've put almost 30k miles on my engine at 505-530 whp in the last few years with only one self induced issue. If you build them right, maintain and take care of them, you'd be surprised how well they can hold up.



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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200570 posted 02/03/15 06:10 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
You couldn't just throw in a set of new forged pistons because the stockers take a completely different piston to wall clearance than the forged pistons would. So you would still have to have a slight hone job done. The stock internals are good for some power and long as you don't have a hiccup.



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cheekychimp Galant VR4.org Moderator
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200577 posted 02/03/15 07:22 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post   
^^^ Yes and in addition whilst I'm not sure how much it really affects longevity (given that a lot of race motors suffer from other breakages in the interim) even building a "bulletproof" engine doesn't guarantee there are no maintenance issues down the road. Some people spend a lot of money building really strong 2.3 stroker engines (who me? ) and yet that means more wear on the cylinder walls due to the more elliptical piston travel meaning shorter periods/mileages before a rebore/hone and the next sized pistons are required.

I've said this a dozen times before but if I ever did another "serious" engine build it would be a 2.4 sleeved block using stock EVO pistons on 6mm longer rods to compensate for the extra deck height. 9.0:1 CR or thereabouts and an easy 9,000 rpms redline. It's a perfect street car combo in my opinion but the OP is building a track car so this might be a bit irrelevant for him. I just mention it because he asked about longevity. I don't have much faith in Slowboy as a company, nothing personal, just too many stories of bad experiences from others. However they did a really good thread on another forum about the benefits of long rod 2.0 litre engines. They posted dyno sheets of cars with fantastic torque curves, making almost 500 horsepower at the same time. Depending on turbo size they were seeing full spool (if I recall correctly) by about 4500-5000 rpm and then pretty much 'flatlining' the torque curve to 8.5K where they said power dropped off when they took their foot off the throttle. I'm not really a fan of big turbos in Hong Kong, I've found the 16G sized turbos to be pretty suitable for the sort of driving I do. Consequently, I'm not sure I'd ever get those type of results because a stock sized turbo would become a restriction at higher rpm. The FP Black on the other hand? I bet that would be an ideal candidate for a long rod engine.



The whole thread is here if you are interested and makes a good read for the pros and cons of a lot of different engine configurations: -

Advantages of a 2.1 stroker

Another thread that might be worth taking a look at, is this one: -

A different engine configuration ...

It's good because it is full of solid information, sensible opinions and constructive criticism, which helps sort out the facts from the bullshit.

I still think for me personally, a sleeved 2.4 long block engine would work extremely well, given the type of driving I do here in Hong Kong, but it 'is' a lot of money to spend on an engine for rather minimal gains. Then again, you could say the same of extrude honing intake manifolds and plenty of very knowledgeable people still do that ...



Getting old sucks ... but it sure beats the alternative !!!


Edited by cheekychimp (02/03/15 07:53 PM)

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