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On the value of heat shielding.

EfiniX

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Oct 18, 2012
Messages
647
Location
portland, or
In this post: Anecdotal support for efficacious mitigation of issues related to heat-soak.

Symptoms include:

Loss of performance when warm
Loss of controlled idle when warm
General poopiness when warm

I had this:



Beautiful to be sure, but there's clearly going to be a heat-soak potential with the intercooler piping running right over the top of that sexy FP racing manifold. Now ever since I had my ETS FMIC kit installed, I was plainly aware of a loss of overall power when negotiating stop-and-go traffic. So long as I was moving, things were better, but once I would sit at a few lights, there was a noticeable loss of power. Not much, but come on; we all notice even a little bit, right? It's what keeps us coming back.

Anyway, I got the new motor and such (see my build thread), and in the process, put in this beautiful FP manifold. The performance increases with the new motor were quite nice, but the heat-soak power loss was more noticeable.

So I wrapped it up.



After wrapping the exhaust in titanium heat shielding, and wrapping the IC piping in Thermo-whatever tape, the difference was quite impressive.

My car doesn't stall when coasting to a stop anymore. Like ever. I'm not calling heat-soak mitigation a panacea of idle problems, but for me, after going through everything else with EHMotorsports (and even replacing my TPS), this is what did it. Now it wasn't happening every time I would coast to a stop. Maybe 15% of the time. But now, 4 months on... not once.

And performance dips during stop-and-go are much, much better. That's to be expected, sure, but it was tangible.

So yeah, pretty neat.
 

prove_it

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Jul 3, 2008
Messages
4,201
Location
Sioux Falls, SD
Hum, I have similiar issues, no stalling though. I'm going mod my new turbo(bastard 20g) to a downfiring housing, in an attempt to reduce heat soak off the FP manifold. Good to see you had good results in wrapping.
 

coyotes

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Nov 15, 2013
Messages
1,544
Location
Seattle, WA
What were your IATs before and after, do you remember? My charge pipe gets pretty hot too, I have been thinking about wrapping it. Have not seen any drivability issues I can attribute to it though.
 

ghostinthevr4

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Joined
Jun 11, 2008
Messages
587
Location
Fresno, Califonia
Looking at your setup EfiniX you might be good about not melting the coupler but I would keep a close eye on them. I had a aluminum radiator that put my pipe closer to the manifold, I see your on the stock radiator so you might be better off.

If you can manage to get your setup down firing Prove it I would do it it'll be a lot cooler. I would love to go down firing but for me it's not feasible for my set up.
 

CSMdiesel

Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2011
Messages
10
Location
Golden, CO
You also have these options to choose from, or like me, you can run both:

click

click

I would choose only the blanket if you are not wanting to spend that much money. I can attest to how well these work together, though.
 

ghostinthevr4

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Jun 11, 2008
Messages
587
Location
Fresno, Califonia
I ran fp blanket on my car it does help, I have no experience with the shield so I can't comment on that one. The beauty of the blanket is fitment with the shield you have to make sure your UICP will clear.
 

Wookalar

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Nov 27, 2013
Messages
458
Location
Arizona USSA
I've never heard of these (or any) engines stalling because of heat soak.

One thing I would change right away because astetically it bugs me is ditch that coupler and weld those two IC pipes together so you have one pipe going from compressor outlet to the IC. Then of course rewrap the pipe. I don't see any reason why there should be two pipes there.

As for heat soak causing a bad idle and stalling, I would look into vacuum leaks and electronics. Have you tested your IAC lately? Have you had your ECU inspected within the last few years?

What kind of coolant are you using? And the last time you refilled the system did you burp it properly?
 

prove_it

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Jul 3, 2008
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4,201
Location
Sioux Falls, SD
A solid pipe from turbo to IC? You must never need to service anything on your car.
 

coyotes

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Nov 15, 2013
Messages
1,544
Location
Seattle, WA
I'd replace all that wrap with the manifold blanket instead. Cleaner and would be easier to service those manifold nuts that keep coming loose. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

that has to be one of the cleanest engine bays around though, looks great. and I imagine that elbow isn't welded to the intercooler. just that coupler in the middle looks redundant.
 

turbowop

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Joined
Apr 29, 2001
Messages
11,971
Location
Yakima, WA
Mine is one single pipe from turbo to intercooler. Two easy to reach clamps and it's off. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif
 

prove_it

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Jul 3, 2008
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Sioux Falls, SD
Yours is top route? I thought yours was downfiring Mark.
 

turbowop

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Yakima, WA
There is a straight coupler behind the driver's side headlight, and the one at the turbo outlet.


944a7fb853d78fd.jpg
 
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coyotes

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Nov 15, 2013
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1,544
Location
Seattle, WA
Mark, is your charge pipe wrapped or just bare in the photo? You have a 2g manifold, heat shield? What's your IATs?

Worth asking since it's on topic. It would be interesting to compare people who are wrapped and who are not. I imagine your hood vents help also if you leave them open?
 

turbowop

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Apr 29, 2001
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Yakima, WA
Completely bare. The 2g manifold has a factory heatshield.

Cruising intake temps are ambient. Stuck in traffic they are a bit hotter, but I attribute that to being stuck in traffic, not due to the pipe being naked. The intake is pulling air from behind the headlight and it's already hot when not moving.

The pipe may get hot, but I don't think that means the air moving through it is pulling all the heat from it. It's not internally finned like an intercooler, yanno? There may be some thermal exchange, but from what I've seen in logs, it's negligible.
 
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prove_it

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Jul 3, 2008
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4,201
Location
Sioux Falls, SD
You have a 2g manifold with heat shield though, an unshielded FP manifold gives off way more heat. I've measured up to 800* at the collector after a hard pull, and around 300-400* during basic start up and prolonged idle.

The curse of the FP manifold.... excessive engine bay heat at the cost of a few more ponies and a cool sound.
 
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turbowop

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Apr 29, 2001
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Yakima, WA
I still have an FP manifold on the shelf I need to install. But I also have a blanket and shield for it as well. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif
 

citymunky

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Sep 22, 2010
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Location
Chesapeake, VA
You still haven't install that yet? I'll buy it back. LOL
 

turbowop

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Apr 29, 2001
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11,971
Location
Yakima, WA
Quoting citymunky:
You still haven't install that yet? I'll buy it back. LOL



If it ain't broke, don't fix it? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/keke.gif

Actually, I plan to pull the turbo and do the HTA upgrade, so I'm waiting. But first I'm gonna have the wheels refinished and customized a bit.
 
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tektic

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Joined
Dec 19, 2012
Messages
1,497
Location
ronkonkoma, ny
I got my ass outside and made a heat shield today.
Didn't take a great picture but here's the idea.
It wraps around the bottom.


Also tapped my turbo housing today, but you can see the installed shield.


So now I have ceramic coating inside and outside and shields.every little bit helps. Would really like some hood vents next.
 
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