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Main Girdle or Crank Scraper?

JSchleim18

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Times aren't looking so good so I am in need of building a motor sooner rather than later. My question is which would you rather have in your motor? I am building this car as a spirited street car with some road racing I hope. Thanks
 

Terry Posten

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A girdle acts like a crank scraper. But it is not really needed for a street car.
 

Brianawd

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Running a Main Girdle is always a good idea. I don't care if its a street car of a track car.
 

Terry Posten

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Don't get me wrong, I just said it was not really needed for a street car.

The confusion might come from the interpretation of "street car".

If this is a 1/4 miler that sees street driving, then spend the money and have a little "piece-of-mind".

But if you do get a girdle, the scraper is not needed.
 

Terrance362

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wow I went throught this a while ago. From what I gathered a crank scraper keeps the oil off the roating assembley and keeps the oil in the pan and a girdle is for bottom in stregth under high rpm's. I ended up buying a kiggly girdle /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 

Rausch

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Quoting Brianawd:
Running a Main Girdle is always a good idea. I don't care if its a street car of a track car.


+1 I think there is WAY more potential benefit here than with a scraper. Scraper is not a bad idea, but in most instance I'd pick the girdle over a scraper.
 

Terry Posten

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If you look at a scraper and a girdle, you will see that a girdle will "scrape" the oil the same.

With the girdle, you must line bore with the girdle in place. It is not a bolt on and go thing. You may also need an aftermarket pan. I have heard some pans don't fit over a girdle.
 

slugsgomoo

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the stock pan is fine with the kiggly girdle, though IIRC the ARP mains may cause a bit of denting to be necessary.

I'm not sure of it doing the same action as a scraper, but then again I don't think those are necessary in the first place. I do however thing it's preposterous to spend all the money to build a motor with nice rods & pistons and not spend the extra money to have it assembled with a girdle on it.

Well, unless you want the mains to walk around and to snap crankshafts. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif
 

Brianawd

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Quote:
You may also need an aftermarket pan. I have heard some pans don't fit over a girdle.



You have the reversed. After market pans will not fit. They do not clear the girdle. You can get them to fit but you have to grind and the reweld. The factory pan fits just fine. You just have to put two small dents in the pan to clearance the arp main studs after you have threaded them out so you have 15mm of thread showing after the main caps and girdle are inplace.
 

belize1334

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Two questions: Do you have to use ARPs with a girdle or could you use OEM hardware? Why do you have to have the girdle and block line bored together?
 

Wizardawd

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Because, like getting your block torque plate bored, the block alters slighty when the head/girdle is bolted to it. And in order to get the best benefit of a girdle, this alteration needs to be accounted for.

The whole purpose of the girdle is to provide extra strength when seeing very high rpms (ie, 9k+). Most street cars will not need a girdle since 90% of your time will be under 4k rpm.

A crank scraper, in order to be of any use, need to literally hug the crank, within less than a 1/4 inch. And it's purpose is to prevent the crank from carrying oil during its spin. This will free up a decent amount of hp due to less drag and will keep the oil in the pan where it needs to be. However, the benefits of a scraper are again, best seen at very high rpms. A windage tray works according to the same theory, but takes a different approach.

A typical crank scraper:
bmw_m52_labled_installed_c.jpg


A windage tray:
944_windage_tray_c.jpg


Kiggly 6-bolt girdle:
Girdle1.jpg


7-bolt OEM girdle:
88777d1225135248-4g63-4g64-swap-girdle.jpg


Wiz
 

Terry Posten

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I knew there was something weird with stock vs. aftermarket pans and such.

I agree that a girdle would be the best but in most apps, not really nessasary.
 

Dialcaliper

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Jun 22, 2007
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Mountain View, CA
AThe way I'd categorize it is that a girdle is for strength, a scraper is for endurance and lubrication (and maybe some fuel economy). Ideally, you'd want both.

More practically, unless you're running a lot of power or a stroker, the scraper will probably do you more good for a street car. The girdle also blocks off a decent amount of area, but it doesn't sit that close to the crank, so it won't really perform like a well designed scraper.

So, 2.0L, Scraper unless you're going overboard. 2.3/2.4L Stroker, Girdle.
 
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