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Anyone have a ClutchNet clutch set? (also 90 vs 91 shift cables)


turboren
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 998496 posted 06/09/11 10:41 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
This is in response to my thread in the Newbies section: click

Cliff's notes:

91 GVR4
90 Tranny
91 xfer case
91 shifter with modified 91 cables
ClutchNet Red 2x PP and Kevlar disc

Having problems shifting into 1st, 2nd, and reverse.

OK, I replaced the clutch pedal assembly with one freshly rebuilt by Shep and adjusted the pedal as per the FSM. Still didn't fix the problem. So, I pulled the tranny, and the pivot ball DID have a shim under it, so THAT's not the problem. Then I noticed the following when I pulled the clutch and pressure plate off:





From the pics above, you can see that the fingers on the PP seem to be contacting the back of the disc in the vicinity of the center spring covers. That shouldn't normally happen, right?

I checked the step on the flywheel, and it's 0.609" which is right in the middle of the range the RRE suggests. The ClutchNet rep told me on the phone that the stock step was what I needed to use (0.612" according to RRE).

It seems like the clutch is not fully disengaging, no matter how long it's held in. As further evidence, once it is in gear, with the clutch fully pushed in, the front drive shafts will spin.

Any ideas?


Edited by turboren (07/23/11 12:57 PM)

Posts: 538 | From: Norfolk, VA | Member Since: 08/20/03 | IP: (70.160.126.59) | Report this post to a Moderator

turboren
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 998593 posted 06/10/11 10:27 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I pulled the stock Exedy clutch from 1078 for comparison. The PP has almost the exact same dimensions, but the disc is different by a good amount. See pictures below:


















The major area of concern seems to be the distance between the surface of the rear spring cover plate to the mounting plate for the friction surface. There's about 0.130" difference between the two. It appears that ClutchNet may have sent the wrong disc, as there's almost no way I could get the flywheel machined to make up that difference in step. I'm quite sure going from 0.609" to 0.612" would not even come close to making this be able to work.

Anyone else have a ClutchNet set?

Posts: 538 | From: Norfolk, VA | Member Since: 08/20/03 | IP: (70.160.126.59) | Report this post to a Moderator

turboren
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1001056 posted 06/22/11 09:23 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Well, I swapped out for the gently used Exedy stock clutch shown above, and the problem went away. There is still some grinding in 1st and 2nd, but that's more likely attributed to bad synchros; the reverse crunch is gone. I can get 1st and 2nd to not grind, if I give enough time for the gears to spool down.

I checked out a friend of mine's 6-puck from ClutchNet, and his looks to be just as tall as my Kevlar disc. He hasn't installed it yet, so he doesn't know if it works or not. Again I ask, does anyone have a ClutchNet setup?

Thanks,

Ren


Edited by turboren (06/22/11 09:29 PM)

Posts: 538 | From: Norfolk, VA | Member Since: 08/20/03 | IP: (70.160.127.85) | Report this post to a Moderator

SleepinGVR4
What are we going to do today Ferb?
629/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1001060 posted 06/22/11 09:39 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Ren I have the same Clutch Net setup as you. And I believe my car does that same thing, but when I had a southbend clutch setup it also did the same thing. I contributed it to driving to long without having the clutch pedal adjusted. Sucks because I had the trans rebuilt 50K miles ago.

What do you mean you have 91 modified cables? I'm using new 91 cables and thought about putting in my old galant cables to see if that makes a difference.



Sean


Edited by SleepinGVR4 (06/22/11 09:45 PM)

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turboren
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1001078 posted 06/22/11 10:40 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Cables are all the same from 91-up, IIRC. I have a 90 trans in mine, so the cables needed to be shortened (or swapped for a set of 90 cables, of which I realized after the fact that I had TWO sets... d'oh!).

The clutch pedal was adjusted correctly, and the pedal assembly was just rebuilt by Shep, so that is definitely not the problem.

Ren

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CutlassJim
poop load of room
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1788/2000
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1001559 posted 06/25/11 12:50 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
My car has the Red pressure plate and whatever matching "race" disc and it doesn't grind at all. Stock DSM tranny too.



ALL DSM's are advanced and ALL Evo's retarded
I love my crazy mother!!!

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turboren
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1002048 posted 06/27/11 08:13 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Apparently the problem was in the design of the clutch disc. I sent it back to ClutchNet and they fixed it:





I called and the guy I spoke with (Russian or some other East European accent) said they replaced the spring housing with an open design. They must have used shorter spacer rivets to hold the spring retainer plates together, too, because the assembly is now MUCH closer to stock (actually a little shorter now, but that shouldn't be a problem). The one thing that didn't change is the hub part. As you'll not if you look closely, the stock disc has the hub ending right at the forward end of the disc, so that the disc rests flat on a table top. The ClutchNet disc, however, has the hub extending about 6mm forward of the front edge of the clutch disc. I don't think this will be a problem, but won't know for sure until I install it. I will keep everyone posted. Basically, though, this looks like it should fix the problem.

So, in short, if your ClutchNet disc looks like the one I first posted, you might want to send it back. They were really helpful, and if this all works out, I'm going to post up (or add to) a Good Guy thread for them. Either way they deserve it, since it has been more than a year since I ordered the part, even though the part had never actually seen the road.

Ren

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SleepinGVR4
What are we going to do today Ferb?
629/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1002530 posted 06/30/11 12:16 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
So they replaced your disc with one that doesn't have spring cages? That's one of the reasons I went with ClutchNet.



Sean

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belize1334
well bread and nobly conceived
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1002782 posted 07/01/11 12:39 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
^^ +1

I went with Clutchnet because of the enclosed spring cages. Mine is a sprung 6-puck and aside from the chatter of a puck disk I have none of the engagement issues you had. But, I've thought about switching to their full-faced disks. Now I'm not so sure because if they don't have the enclosed cages I see no reason not to go with a different company like SouthBend.



Roger B. Scott
'91 Belize Green

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SleepinGVR4
What are we going to do today Ferb?
629/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1003533 posted 07/06/11 02:19 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
This is my experience with south bend... Now they may have changed their clutches since then.

When I ordered a south bend a couple of years ago the pressure plate looked like their own pressure plate but the disk was an exedy disk. Only got 50K miles on it before the metal tabs holding the springs in broke off on two different spots on the disk. Need less to say the car wouldn't go in gear after that.



Sean

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turboren
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1007101 posted 07/23/11 01:19 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post   
Sorry for the delay in responding. I replaced the grinding 1-2 tranny and used the newly fixed ClutchNet setup. (Unfortunately I replaced the tranny with one that grinds in 1 through 4 instead of just 1 and 2, but that's another story.)

That fixed the problem for the most part. I was still having some engagement issues, but once in gear, I could redline it and the axles wouldn't move.

To fix the engagement issues, I first tried adjusting the clutch pushrod. When that didn't fix it, I decided to try replacing the shift cables.

The tranny currently in 224/2000 is a 90 DSM tranny. I had read many times that you had to use 90 shift cables and brackets if you used a 90 tranny, but the 91 shifter was ok to use. That was only partly true. I was able to get that to work, sort of, but I had to adjust the fore/aft cable so far out that it barely had one thread into the turnbuckle.

I had already found out that you couldn't use 91 cables with the 90 trans, because the opposite issue was a problem: the turnbuckle couldn't be turned in far enough on the fore/aft cable (shortening it up), so I had to cut down on the turnbuckle and the threaded ends of the cable and rod-end, and had to die some new threads onto the cable, and it still barely fit right.

Turns out the solution was to use the 91 cables and brackets. Of course, I had to adjust the cables for the shortened throw, but it worked so much better than using the shortened 91 cables on the 90 brackets, or the 90 cables on the 90 brackets.

So, to sum up:

1. The ClutchNet setup works like a champ now. And it's so light it's hard to believe it's a performance clutch.
2. You can use the 91 cables and shifter on a 90 trans, if you also use the 91 brackets.

Hope this helps someone.

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