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Code 23 (CAS), low idle. help?

Whoodoo

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Jul 11, 2009
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Binghamton, NY
I just did my top end and tried taking the car out for the first time this morning.

It idles ok, sometimes dropping down low and coughing now and again. When I actually drove it though, it has no power, has lots of vibration, and coughs a lot. The CEL came on so I checked the codes and it was throwing a 22 - crankshaft angle sensor. I thought perhaps I installed the CAS 180 degrees off, so I flipped it around and it behaved exactly the same way, but now is throwing a 23 - camshaft angle sensor.

Is my timing just so badly off that it is trying it's hardest just to stay alive?

When I first started up the engine, it was sans a knock sensor, so I thought the occasional coughing was due to the ECU seeing 40 counts of knock all the time. However I got the knock sensor in and it is doing the same stuff so I'm now stumped.

Just for anyone who hasn't been keeping up with the 62 build thread, all I have done that isn't stock replacement is a BS delete and some mild cams.
 
Last edited:

Barnes

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Feb 9, 2003
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Richland, WA
Datalogger showing anything interesting other than the code?
 

Whoodoo

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Binghamton, NY
I don't have a logger. I was checking codes using the MPI diagnostics connector and a multimeter.

I didn't pay much attention to how the plug wires are arranged so they are all laying on top of each other. Would this me an issue?
 

mitsuturbo

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Try swapping in a different CAS.

If you dont have one, i can let you borrow one as long as it's returned.
 

Whoodoo

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Funny story... The wires for cylinders 1 and 2 were swapped at the coils. She runs great now but still has a code 23. I'll try switching the CAS back 180 to see if that cures it. I find it very odd, though, that the code swapped from a crank position fault to a cam position fault. Needless to say, its good to be back!
 

SouthCaliVR4

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North county San Diego
easy enough mistake, speaks volumes you're willing to admit to it. Glad to hear she's up & running. hope the cas issue turns out to be an easy fix.
 

Whoodoo

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Binghamton, NY
So I turned the CAS back around to see if the code would change back to a 22, but alas, it remains a 23.

I took it down to the nearest gas station to get some air in the tires and when I pulled back into the driveway, there was so smoke coming from under the hood. I'm 95% sure its the timing cover leaking oil out the front onto the exhaust heat shield. the bolt in the middle has oil seeping up around it - I know this because I wiped that bolt clean from the oil that was around it before starting it up. Why is there oil seeping up from around the timing cover bolt? is the gasket not seated properly? Its a brand new mitsu gasket, but I installed it dry. I guess I'll sort that issue once it's cooled a bit and then I guess I'll have to borrow a CAS to get this CEL sorted.
 

Whoodoo

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Binghamton, NY
In my searchings for advice on the oil leak, someone mentioned putting RTV on the middle bottom exhaust manifold stud because it goes through to a main oil drain. Perhaps this is adding to the burning oil issues, but what do you all think about it? None of the old studs had RTV on em, so maybe this was someone's bandaid or precautionary action?
 

Whoodoo

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Misuturbo was nice enough to loan me a CAS today. It didn't change anything, so I know for a fact the sensor is good. Perhaps it is a wiring issue then? I really need some guidance on where to go from here, otherwise I'll be pouring through wiring diagrams and poking around with a multimeter until something jumps out at me.
 

SouthCaliVR4

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North county San Diego
check the wiring ecu to cas, be sure to check for shorts to ground. if all checks good try another ecu. I know it's easyer said than done but a tel ecu will work to test. Are you sure it wasn't a 23 the whole time & you didn't miscount the blink out? these cars should have come with a propper scanner!! mucho simpler to figgure these things out with a live datastream.
 

Whoodoo

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Binghamton, NY
I don't have a timing light (Im trying to see if any of my friends do). I know the timing is off, but why would this cause a CAS code?
 

Whoodoo

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Binghamton, NY
I got a timing light and the timing is now per spec. Base timing is right at 5* BTDC. Idle goes no further than 10* BTDC but wavers back and forth between 7 and 10 at idle.

Idle is still low (usually around 600 RPM) and I'm still getting a code 23...

I haven't checked any wiring but I'm not sure really what I'm looking for. I don't want to mess with the BISS to get the idle up until the code goes away. Other than that the car runs really well. I'm not getting all the lights on the stock boost gauge to light up until really high in the rev range, but I could very well have a boost leak somewhere. I'll be doing a boost leak test in the near future to make sure of that.

What kind of signal does the CAS give to the ECU?
 

That boost gauge is a dummy gauge. It lights up acording to the RPMs from what I understand. Higher the revs, the more the lights light. A real boost gauge is a must with these cars. My ecu is set up to where my dummy boost gauge is now my knock sensor.
 

SouthCaliVR4

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It's calculated off the mas airflow sensor & rpms, any changes, such as 2g mas, hacked mas, afc... render it worthless. Not that it was ever exactly acurate in the first place. Keydiver altered the stock gauge to a knock sum gauge. You're best off with a proper boost gauge. Mine still functions as a boost gauge, I use it to help me maintain better gas mi, I have figgured how many bars before I am in real boost & keep throttle & rpms below that point to gain mpg. I'd rather it be a knock gauge but untill he goes back to making chips /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif
 

Whoodoo

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Binghamton, NY
I checked the wiring to the CAS and it seems to be functioning very normally. So, I figured I would pull the ECU to make sure it was still good. The PO said he took care of it so I was an idiot and didn't get things done. I checked it when I first bought the car and there was no damage. Pull it today, and one of the caps is leaking pretty bad.

I don't know if that has caused the issue because it didn't throw codes when it broke and I didn't change anything when working on the engine. So maybe the codes just never cleared from the ecu. I unplugged it and we'll see if it comes back. In the mean time, I'll be getting a hold of Terry for a cap replacement.
 

SouthCaliVR4

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Sorry to hear about an ecu issue but on the bright side I'd say you have found the source of your problem. That acid could have been eating at your ecu the whole time the car was down & thus the reason it acted up only after you put it back in play, terry will get you fixed up no doubt.
 

mitsuturbo

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Quoting Whoodoo:
I checked the wiring to the CAS and it seems to be functioning very normally. So, I figured I would pull the ECU to make sure it was still good. The PO said he took care of it so I was an idiot and didn't get things done. I checked it when I first bought the car and there was no damage. Pull it today, and one of the caps is leaking pretty bad.

I don't know if that has caused the issue because it didn't throw codes when it broke and I didn't change anything when working on the engine. So maybe the codes just never cleared from the ecu. I unplugged it and we'll see if it comes back. In the mean time, I'll be getting a hold of Terry for a cap replacement.


If you want to swing by this weekend i'd be willing to help you out again. We can play the "throw some parts at it" game. I have four spare ECUs, and two cars that ran fine when torn down, so all their electronic giblets are known good.
We can toss a stock ecu in it, or we can toss the dsmlink enabled one in, hook up the tablet PC, and go to town. You probably still have my #. Just gimme a call. No worries. Let's get your car going proper!
 

SouthCaliVR4

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/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/applause.gifLove this site & people on it /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/worthy.gif
 

Whoodoo

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Jul 11, 2009
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Binghamton, NY
Ok, so we found out that its actually throwing a knock sensor code... because the knock sensor was fubar. I thought I had fixed it, but I guess not.

Low Idle will be fixed by messing with the BISS.

I had my dad take a look at my ECU and his trained eyes says that the corrosion I had thought I saw was actually some epoxy used to do a repair. In a closer examination, I had to agree. It seems that at some point the caps were done and some other things were done to it. Don't ask me why, but there are a few new wires, transistors, and things added in at some point. For now, its not broken so I won't fix it.

Thanks for all the help from you on the boards. Also a special thank you to mitsuturbo for lending a hand and spare parts for trouble shooting.
 
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