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What Would it Take to Repair...

raptorWagon

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May 17, 2007
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Oak Harbor, WA
The rear end on the car? I know very few have been through a complete teardown and rotisserie restoration, but what are all your thoughts on welding to resupport the rear section of the frame? from my project build you can tell I've been dealing with a lot of rust, but as seen in this photo which is right above the gas tank, it is pretty bad. I refuse to give up on this car and understand it's going to be a long term goal and a lot of work to get it back to 100% again.

I poked the metal near the hole earlier and a small piece broke free /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/uhh.gif
img1285w.jpg


Just looking for ideas and any sort of path to complete this task, thanks gvr4.org
 
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raptorWagon

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^ That's not too bad of an idea, as it seems to be only the rear clip that is the worst and the left side looks worse than the passenger side.
 

toybreaker

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Apr 30, 2006
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Damn, that picture makes me sad. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

As these cars get older, many of us will find ourselves facing this problem. Getting ahead of the curve will minimise the damage that will have to be contended with.

It looks like your car has led a life in one of the areas that salts the roads, or has just been used as mitsubishi intended, and then not washed up after the fact.

I feel your pain

I've got a shell that is so fawkin clean from the outside it looks like a showcar...

However, underneath it's covered in unrepairable corrosion.

The 4 wheel steering pump is just a big shapeless blob on top of the diff. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

There's really no cost/time effective way to save it. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif



With the recent snows, many of us have been out rallying around. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/devil.gif



For many of us, this has been on "prepared" roads.

I prefer prepared vehicles and untreated roads, but in these new pussified/lawyer dictated times, the local department of transportations feel the need to use huge quantities of salt and/or mag chloride to keep the soccer moms safe.

Anytime you see a white film in the runoff on the sides of the road, you're running on a prepared surface, and that sh*t is getting in every nook and cranny under your car when you pass over sections of road that's wet with the runoff.

Not rinsing this crap off the bottom of your ride after running on these prepared roads will lead to issues further down the line, gaurandamnteed.

Salt = instant corrosion, but even mag chloride will give you grief, and it corrodes the ever lovin sh*t out of aluminum and electrical systems.

Let this picture be a reminder of what happens if you don't clean up after having fun.



Just rinsing the sheetmetal/outside body off won't cut it. You've got to rinse the bottom of your car thoroughly.

If you don't get all the nooks and crannies, your fuel/brake/4 wheel steering hardlines (and other components) under the car will corrode, making underbody service a f***ing nightmare in years to come.

Hardware will break every f***ing time you want to do a simple little job, and just changing something as simple as brake pads and bleeding the brakes can take all day and fill the air with colorfull adjectives.

In addition, the corrosion will eventually set in and attack the unibody itself, leading to the problems raptorreed is now facing.


There are certain areas of the car that will be worse than others.

The pockets in the front fenders collect leaves and other organic debris that drains down from the cowl. Almost every single vr4 I've looked at has *some* corrosion there. Killing the corrosion there will prevent pinholes from forming that will allow moisture into the rocker rails. Once corrosion starts in the rocker rails, it's just a matter of time before it's game over from a structural standpoint.

The bottoms of the doors, and along the impact protection beams inside them is another place where corrosion is occuring on the majority of our cars. Just pulling the doorpanels once or twice a year, rinsing down the insides, and cleaning out the drain holes in the door bottoms will go a long way to minimising the problem

Throwing the car up on stands once or twice a year and rinsing out all the rocker panel structures and other underbody structures will flush out the dirt and debris that will soak up moisture and trap it against the metal.

At the very least con one of the chickies at the gas station out of a drive thru (brushless! ) automated car wash, (with underbody rinse,) after every storm.



There are several rust conversion products out there that will stop the corrosion proccess.

I like the Eastwood product line, but there are other products that will work just as well at halting the progression of underbody corrosion.


Raptoreed, I feel your pain.

Not a lot you can do but start replacing entire sections of the floor.

I've done this job on a few datsun z cars. It brings the suck in ways you just can't even fathom untill you've been there and done that.

It is doable, you're just going to have to really want to do it.

You will get the best results if you kill it everywhere it's got a foothold.

Before starting the massive amount of work this project will require, I would advise you to look at the entire underbody, and be sure there isn't any other ares that will require heroic measures.

Many times, it's better to just buy a shell that's being parted and transfer your goodies onto that platform.

Good luck with the project, whatever you decide to do. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif



cliffs

Corrosion sucks

Rinse your car after every storm, top and bottom.
Drive thru brushless car washes work well several times a month.
Just let everything cool down first, and drive it dry afterwords.

Inspect your car every spring, paying close attention to the hardlines. Anywhere you see pitting or peeling of the plastic coating, clean the area thoroughly and top coat them with something that will halt the corrosion proccess.

Pull the fuel pump access cover in the trunk and clean the top of the tank/fuel pump bracket, and apply some rust preventative product to the hardware everynow and then.

A little time spent cleaning up will make future service much more enjoyable, allow you to keep your car in top form, and it will pay large dividends if you ever decide to sell your car.
 

DR1665

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Joined
Oct 19, 2005
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4,642
Location
Iowa City, IA
Damn, John. That's the full, comprehensive, come-with-me-if-you-want-to-live monty right there. Solid.

I can't see the picture (stupid work filter), but if the floor pan is that jacked, I'd say there are two options (already mentioned above):

1. Buy a clean shell and swap everything over.
2. Break out the "serious tools" and replace the crusty bits.

If I had a welder, tube bender, time, money, and skill, I think it would be ideal to swap the good bits to a clean shell for daily driving enjoyment, but then I would take the old shell and go Mad Max on it. I'd cut the nose off at the firewall and replace everything ahead of it with a custom, tubular frame. Then I'd do the same thing to the ass end. I'd cage it to follow the contours of the cabin, tab the cage so the roof could be bolted to the cage, then connect those front and rear sections with tubing along the driveshaft tunnel and door sills.

The idea would be to eventually cut away most, if not all, the unibody, while still being able to hang the exterior sheetmetal to the car to look stock. The chassis would be nearly indestructible and safe as Fort Knox. I might make it RWD and bounce it on baja shocks too.

Of course, this is just a dream. I'd have a hard enough time talking my wife into another Galant, let alone a stripped shell. :p

Back on topic, if you don't have massive corrosion in multiple areas, I'd say you could probably cut out the cancer and graft in clean bits from a FWD car. It's going to be a metric shitton of work, but as someone who's mixed and matched Galant chassis pieces (and is *this close* to having his hacked VR4 back on the road legally) it feels really f***ing good to know you saved one.
 

raptorWagon

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May 17, 2007
Messages
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Location
Oak Harbor, WA
History: Up until I got a hold of it, it has been a Appalachian mountain car, Boone NC.


Oh I have looked at the front itself, it does have surface rust on the subframe and control arms, but the rear is what took it the worst. The whole rear suspension has already been replaced, including the rear diff. The original subframe was cracked on the right side bushing mount (where it mounts to the car) all the way through the metal and up the side.

You could almost call this car a 91' Mitsubishi Galant Talon VR4, because all the parts on the rear end are from a either a 90' Talon or a 94' Talon.

4WS pump, pretty much what my pump looked like. The actual pump sending unit cover is NOT going to come off.

The driveshaft is in crap shape. I have one off a 90' talon in better shape just needs a galant center section. I have thought about just picking up another car to transfer my project to, but I would really want to restore this car knowing it will cost a great amount of time trying to tackle the cancer.

Looking at old pics I have it looks as though the frame all around the fuel tank is what has the worst condition of everything
IMG_0374.jpg

IMG_0373.jpg


Old original rear subframe - Arrow points to location of where the crack was
IMG_0752-1-1.jpg



If you need a visual of what toybreaker means what can happen to the 4WS lines and pump, here you go
IMG_0758-1.jpg

img1555jx.jpg


This is going to suck!
 
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Whoodoo

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Jul 11, 2009
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Binghamton, NY
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bawling.gif Im sorry dude. If I could give you some rust free-ness I would...
 

deez

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May 29, 2004
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Location
Chico, CA
thank goodness I have a California car.
 

89Mirageman

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Jul 5, 2006
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Location
Stantonsburg, NC
Most are gonna cringe when they read this but we are all entitled to our opinion. I would just look for another shell and use that one for parts, either that or sell it to someone else who doesn't really care about the rust and start over. These cars are rare but from what I've seen, they still sell way too cheap to even bother with major rust issues. It would be far less expensive and time consuming in the long run.
 

raptorWagon

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May 17, 2007
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Oak Harbor, WA
After talking to one of my new supervisors in my shop that does body work and paint on the side, we agreed that once I get the car running under its' own power again I'm taking it to his house to start reconstructing the rear end. I rechecked the area above the fuel tank, when I gave it another shot at getting the sending unit off..that didn't happen. The area above the the tank isn't too bad after all, rusty yes, but not totally gone. The side stud and center stud on the foward facing side of the tank, those two "rails" if you will are what make it bad. A little welding, a lot of POR-15 and sweat and we'll see what happens /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif. then we'll repaint the car once everything is said and done /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif.



 
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curtis

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May 4, 2003
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Clarksville TN
Man first thing I would do is find a rear subframe from a 1st gen. that is non rusty. I had one but threw it out because it was in the way. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif Figured no one would need or want it because of the shipping cost. As for all the rest a welder and new steel is all you need just make everything clean and renting a plasma cutter will be worth the price you pay. I'll warn you go ahead and by a fuel cell because with that much damage I'm sure the gas tank is just as bad on top.
 

raptorWagon

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Oak Harbor, WA
Quoting Curtis:
Man first thing I would do is find a rear subframe from a 1st gen. that is non rusty. I had one but threw it out because it was in the way. Figured no one would need or want it because of the shipping cost. As for all the rest a welder and new steel is all you need just make everything clean and renting a plasma cutter will be worth the price you pay. I'll warn you go ahead and by a fuel cell because with that much damage I'm sure the gas tank is just as bad on top.




Curtis...check my build thread, all the rear suspension components down to brakes have been replaced /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif. First thing I did when i bought the car was the subframe.
Want to build me one? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
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