Lukefraizer
(Member)
02/09/11 01:05 AM
Battery Trunk Relocation

So tonight I relocated the battery to the trunk! However now im looking for a tray that is nice and sturdy. Anyone know of any or know of a good way to fab them?

TylerAdamson
(circles method)
02/09/11 01:13 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Summit Racing sells quite a variety of battery boxes at different price points.

Lukefraizer
(Member)
02/09/11 01:28 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

sweet thanks

**DONOTDELETE**
(Unregistered)
02/09/11 09:45 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

We used the stock tray, slightly modified. Worked great. Threw a coat of powder on it and it looks brand new. It's strapped down with the factory tie downs.
I ordered a box from summit originaly, but the thing was huge. Looks more like a tool box, so that's it's present use


The_Big_Weave
(Member +)
02/09/11 11:45 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

You can also buy a battery box at walmart for like 6 bucks.

Ian M
(waiting for the bus)
02/09/11 12:01 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

^Be mindfull if you plan to drag race though,that those cheap marine battery boxes aren't NHRA approved. Depending on how anal the tech guy is or what kind of day he's having that might be a problem.

mitsuturbo
(Banthony )
02/09/11 12:27 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

You dont have to have it in a box if it's in the trunk, but you DO have to have a battery cutoff switch that KILLS THE CAR IF RUNNING. This means it has to kill the alternator output as well, so you will need a 2 circuit cutoff switch in order for everything to work right, unless you plan on disconnecting your alternator when they do tech inspection.

You're "supposed" to have the trunk sealed off from the rest of the car with a piece of sheet aluminum or metal, but as long as there's a back seat, i've never encountered any issue with the track officials letting me run with the battery simply bolted down properly. You -will- however, want to run a SEALED battery if you're not going to use a sealed battery box. If you don't you will get corrosion in the trunk, and that's definitely not a good thing!


Adorsey
(Member +)
02/09/11 01:05 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Yeah the marine boxes they make are not the best. There usually too big and let the battery move around inside. Although, there is usually a strap of some sort, its usually just to keep the lid on, and not tie down the battery.

I like the sealed battery box look. Very clean, if done correctly, and I also like the "push-off" rod for an external kill switch.

But, I had the material to make this, and saved some $ too










A tray like this might be a good route. I do plan to use breakers when I set up my external kill switch.(and maybe a nice cover over everything)
I will most likly use the key hole in the truck to mount the kill switch.


bustedsm
(trying to feel really special)
02/09/11 05:42 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Actually, you don't need a box if it's a dry cell battery.

Brunoboy
(Jesus Clips)
02/09/11 05:51 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

quick question before the topic goes bad, if you have a box in the trunk, can you use a regular battery? I had three optimas go bad on me, one was old and needed replacement,one was drained because the car wasnt used, and then i got it covered under warranty and it happened again. My box is already in the trunk mind you.

Ian M
(waiting for the bus)
02/09/11 06:16 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

NHRAonline.com tech question FAQ:

click

Quote:

I have a street car that I occasionally run at the strip. I've relocated the battery to the rear. What else do I need?


Any car with a relocated battery must be equipped with a master electrical cutoff, capable of stopping all electrical functions including ignition (must shut the engine off, as well as fuel pumps, etc.). The switch must be located on the rear of the vehicle, with the "off" position clearly marked. If the switch is of a "push / pull" type, then "push" must be the motion that shuts off the switch, and plastic or "keyed" typed switches are prohibited. Also, the battery must be completely sealed from the driver and/or driver compartment. This means a metal bulkhead must separate the trunk from the driver compartment, or the battery must be located in a sealed, metal box constructed of minimum .024 inch steel or .032 inch aluminum, or in an NHRA accepted plastic box. In cars with a conventional trunk, metal can simply be installed behind the rear seat and under the package tray to effectively seal the battery off from the driver. In a hatchback type vehicle the battery box is usually the easiest solution, since the alternative is to fabricate a bulkhead which seals to the hatch when closed. At present, Moroso is the only company which offers an NHRA accepted plastic battery box, part number 74050.



But I drive on the street. I don't want a big cut off switch hanging on the back.


This solution takes a little work, but it solves the problem. Install the master cutoff inside the vehicle, positioned "sideways" so that the toggle moves forward and back. Drill a hole in the toggle handle, and attach a steel rod that will run out the back of the car, through a hole drilled completely through one tail light assembly. Have a spare tail light assembly on hand, so when you come home from the drags, you remove the rod and put the cherry tail light back in for street cruising. Next time you plan on going to the drag strip, swap lights and reinstall the rod. Since the drilled light is for the strip only, you can also have it marked "PUSH OFF" in big letters so the Tech Inspectors will think you're cool.






toybreaker
(it's peace of mind at 100 mph plus)
02/09/11 06:32 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Quoting brunoboy:

quick question before the topic goes bad, if you have a box in the trunk, can you use a regular battery? <> My box is already in the trunk mind you.




It's important to note that conventional lead acid batteries produce hydrogen gas during the charge cycle, and they must be vented to outside the vehicle

Those vapors are extremely flamable, in addition to being corrosive as hell.



moral to the story vent your battery outside the car


SmoothCustomer
(Public school educated knowitall)
02/09/11 07:59 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Somebody (curtis) should make trays with tie downs that mount conveniently in the trunk for dry cell batteries like this: Click

FlyingEagle
(Eager Beaver)
02/09/11 09:46 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Quoting toybreaker:

Quoting brunoboy:

quick question before the topic goes bad, if you have a box in the trunk, can you use a regular battery? <> My box is already in the trunk mind you.




It's important to note that conventional lead acid batteries produce hydrogen gas during the charge cycle, and they must be vented to outside the vehicle

Those vapors are extremely flamable, in addition to being corrosive as hell.



moral to the story vent your battery outside the car




Colt C53A.

Vented, bolted in with 3/8 threaded rod through 1" square tubing, down through the rear frame channels and yes, it takes up too much space.











Pardon the mess, and the baby seat strap which was part of my reason for making this as safe as possible. Now I fully realize I have no cutoff switch and moreover, a full shutoff for the starter circuit, fuel pump, and charging circuits, and a full panel to keep the rear hatch area fully contained in the event of an accident. I would not trust small threaded rod (factory tie downs) in a serious accident, whereby passengers may be meeting a large object inside the cabin. I have survived a decent front end collision but that battery was almost crushed in place, versus possibly being tossed about the cabin. The way it is installed, it doesn't add more than a few pounds of metal, it vents on the opposite side of the muffler exit point (probably wouldn't be enough fume to ignite anything with a vehicle moving/flame out the pipe anyways! hehe)

Whatever people do with this thread, please install the largest possible power wire, use good connectors, and have a good ground - with clean metal exposed. No charging issues on this car - PERIOD. The volts you read at the battery post are identical at the alternator, and also being read by the ECU via pocketlogger. I have used 4 awg wiring or larger (2 awg for the starter circuit) to run for the alternator and related charging circuits. All those tiny stock wires are now gone, and so is the corrosion that was more than lightly settled into them (ground at the base of the stock battery box to the frame). I updated my post after Curtis posted below, because it is safe to say that my pictures did not tell the whole picture.


iceman69510
(Turn Right Racing)
02/09/11 11:24 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

I made this (originally in aluminum, but later remade in steel to handle the weight) then bolted the box down to it.







mitsuturbo
(Banthony )
02/10/11 12:15 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Ian M. stated it perfectly with his quote. This is the exact information i went by when i did my trunk mount in 1411. I raced sporadically (and slow) enough that there was never an issue with me not having things walled off with sheet metal. Your track officials may care more about this, and be more "sticklers" about it. My experience was that if it was a street car, they'd let it slide provided the factory seat and rear deck was completely intact. If your rear seat was out or the "package tray" were not intact, they'd send people home saying they needed to have shit walled off properly.

curtis
(Space Blanket from NASA plumbed into the attic)
02/10/11 10:55 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Quoting SmoothCustomer:

Somebody (curtis) should make trays with tie downs that mount conveniently in the trunk for dry cell batteries like this: Click




I would but not to many people like those lawnmower batteries. I being one of them. Track car may be fine but I know of 3 or 4 cars that had those little turds and always had weirdo problems. One was a bumped compression evo with a buch of upgrades. Had drivibility issues as well as starting problems. sad when you have a 40K+ evo and makes over 700 to the tires but can't start and burnt up 2 factory starters before he realized I was right. Put in the big red top and has zero problems.

Now for the guys with batteries in the trunk or guys planning on putting them there.

Please for the love of God run another cable from the ground back up front. To optimize an electrical system for a stereo people will run huge fricking wires from there battery to the amp but leave the stock wires on the battery and even smaller wires from the alternator. But will put an upgrade alternator on. Think use the brain .


Best way to do it is take on of those screw in lugs from auto zone that go in the side post gm batteries. Find a hole with a nut welded on the backside of the firewall or fender well and drill out and re tap to that size. Then for the 12volt pos buy a distribution block/bus from a stereo shop that has a piece of phenolic resin or heavy teflon/abs to separate from ground. Get all this mounted nice then start running cable.

First huge 2-0 from distribution block to starter. Then another factory cable or a huge from alternator to little fuse block piece on the top of your battery now. I think there's 2 or 3 fuses on that piece. Now run a huge cable from the 12 volt block in the inter fender well through the big rubber plug up next to the top of the door and into the car. Run this down under the carpet and around the corner of the backseat into the truck corner.


Next is the ground side. Run it from the battery to thew trunk floor and find a place to connect it. Then forward stopping at any and every bolt hole you can find until you hit the side post deal you bolted on. You can daisy chain them or find the crimp on lugs that can be opened up and just strip out a section of insulation and attach as you go. Now that its upfront get a ton of ground wires or one of those kits on ebay and run grounds everywhere. Don't forget the t body, trans, cas, head, intake manifold, valve cover, mount next to the alternator. Etc.

Reason being is copper flows about 7 or 8 times the amount of current than iron or steel. The guys with a battery in the trunk and only a ground to the floor are hurting gas mileage, giving weirdo problems and not optimizing the system. cause back there you have one thin piece of sheetmetal with maybe 10 spot welds and a ton of seem sealer to flow around.

If you want to not believe me and aren't scared to do math click below. Maybe that will change your mind.

resistivity click me


By just adding a bunch of ground wires. My wifes Honda passport picked up 3mpg on the interstate and her next truck the xterra picked up almost 2mpg. Now the VR4 didn't matter but I did see alot faster starting, better driviblity and alot of idle wub wubs went away when I did all mine.

Anymore to this you could had a big circuit breaker, battery cut offs, then larger wires to fuel pumps and hidden switches going to the fuel pump relay, ignition transistor, etc as an anti thief device.

As for the wire bigger is better but don't get home wiring with 8 or 10 strands get welding cable from a farm supply or some of the sexy oxygen free stereo cable. I used stereo stuff mainly because I had it. The city had an auction and I was helping them by cleaning out the cars. The cops got sick of me bringing them more and more stuff to log in as the setup day went by so they told me to throw it all away. I had the trunk of the vr4 full of drug dealer stereo install kits as well as 4 amps one being a memphis bell class d. Lets here it for law enforcement.

EBAY LINK for ground kits


Struc
(Not all filled in)
02/11/11 03:33 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

I bought some Hobart 4AWG Welding cable to use for my grounding. It's good quality stuff, and not priced too outrageous.

Amazon link to Hobart welding cable

Amazon sells 2awg stuff as well.


NickDromez
(Member)
02/13/11 02:37 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Quoting brunoboy:

quick question before the topic goes bad, if you have a box in the trunk, can you use a regular battery? I had three optimas go bad on me, one was old and needed replacement,one was drained because the car wasnt used, and then i got it covered under warranty and it happened again. My box is already in the trunk mind you.



Brunoboy, before u keep buying new batterys I highly suggest getting rid of the 4gauge wire and start running full 0 gauge to the engine bay. Makes a huge difference.


iceman69510
(Turn Right Racing)
02/16/11 10:33 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Found picture of the steel support tray I made.




mitsuturbo
(Banthony )
02/17/11 12:53 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Wasn't thinking right. Made another thread. Shoulda just put what i wanted to see here.

The best trunk mounted battery setup i've seen yet, is the one in 1051. I know some of you out there also have really well thought out trunk mounts... i'd like to see them, with detailed information of what wiring/switch you used, if possible. I know a dual circuit switch is REQUIRED on our cars to pass tech inspection. I've yet to find online, a flaming river "big switch" with a dual circuit, though. I know it's weak to bite off someone else's setup, but i'd really like to do a thru-taillight like Mark's done. Of course, i'm open to alternative configurations.

Also, how do you mount a battery inside the battery box? I've never seen inside a properly mounted battery box. I *really* do not understand putting a battery inside a metal box, either! I'd like to go with a plastic batt box, to reduce possibility of shorting. I just picked up a new optima yellow top tonight, so my choice has been made to go with a trunk mount. I dont want it to be just slapped in there like it was on 1411. This needs to be a proper, clean install, and retain the spare tire.

Photos of ONLY trunk mounted battery setups would be great here. I do not care to hear about ANY under-hood alternatives. So let me see whatcha got. WITH DETAILS.

Edit: after some MOAR searching, i came up with this photo.. this will help me a little.

Although, I really need to see how the battery is mounted inside the box, as well. I also still want to see other configs, and switch options.

So far, this thread is ok, but i don't really see a whole lot here that i can really use. The support structure looks nice to get the battery more out of the way. I suppose i could maybe do that to hold a battery box, once i see how they're held down and the battery is secured inside.


turbowop
(Hard Snarker)
02/17/11 03:26 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

That pic is pretty old, but the wiring is mostly the same, albeit cleaner now. I'll have to find the detailed ones I have saved somewhere to show how it's all mounted with the box now. Basically, the hold-down bolts go through the bottom of the box inside of it and the strap holds down the battery and the box. Then you can remove the lid freely.

JSchleim18
(Minor 69er)
02/17/11 09:08 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation




I used an aluminum plate bolted down to the bumper bracket under the carpet you see in the pic. Then I drilled a small hole to hold down the other side of the plate. I drilled small holes in the same aluminum plate for the battery tie down.

Also have a 4 post cut off switch in the back there and a 200A circuit breaker. Should be good enough for HPDE.

Battery box is Summit Racing but it was clean and looks good.


mitsuturbo
(Banthony )
02/17/11 12:59 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Very nice, JSchleim18. Precisely what i'm looking for. Once we get turbowop's up here, we'll have a thread that basically shows the "right" way to trunk mount a battery! I knew you guys wouldn't disappoint! Thank you.

iceman69510
(Turn Right Racing)
02/17/11 01:04 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

My battery is not held down in the box, but I used factory style j-bolts to bolt the entire box to the mount, which is of course bolted to the floor.

Not set up with any kill switch though, just a streetcar.


turbowop
(Hard Snarker)
02/17/11 05:27 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Here are a few pics of my setup that are already on my HDD.

From above:




From the side, you can see the hold down rod exiting the box and going through the trunk floor:




Rod is held in place under trunk floor by one large washer and nut on either side of the unibody rail:




Old battery terminal is turned around and held to the large fuse box cover with a custom zip-tie configuration. 2awg wire feeds the battery in the trunk and a separate 4awg wire feeds the alternator wire back to the kill switch/battery.



mitsuturbo
(Banthony )
02/18/11 12:09 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Thanks so much. This is perfect!

I'll be doing my box very similar to this, and the switch as well.
I'll have a slightly different setup under the hood, though. I'll add to this thread when i do my install. Hopefully in a couple of weeks.


SmoothCustomer
(Public school educated knowitall)
02/18/11 12:36 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Quoting turbowop:

Here are a few pics of my setup that are already on my HDD.






Are you venting your battery? If you are, how are you doing this?


turbowop
(Hard Snarker)
02/18/11 03:02 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

No, although the box came with some tubing that would be used as the vent. That would require drilling a hole in the box and a hole in the trunk floor to pass the tubing through to use as a vent. Since I have a sealed Optima, I didn't bother. Just having the box and kill switch satisfied any track officials looking at my setup so far.

mitsuturbo
(Banthony )
03/12/11 01:12 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

I need to figure out how I'm going to do this, and have a kill switch that actually shuts the car off.
I was thinking maybe a dual circuit switch, with the small (secondary) circuit running to primary power on the ECU, or maybe something on the alternator.

First, i wonder how the plastic plug and 2 wires on the alternator works... does anyone know? It just brings up the field so it will charge, doesn't it? I was thinking it would be best to maybe put one of those two wires on the switch, since they don't carry charge current, right? I was hoping to get by with some 8 gauge or so, for that. I've already got 1/0 AWG to run from batt to factory terminal (junction post, actually) and a fancy schmancy battery terminal to match. I've got a 140a circuit breaker, but the posts seem kinda small. I may get something more suited for 0awg wire, if i can find it.

Any suggestions are welcome. I don't want to have to unplug the 2 prong on the alternator when i go to the track, just to pass tech as i've done before.


iceman69510
(Turn Right Racing)
03/12/11 09:49 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Quoting turbowop:

That would require drilling a hole in the box and a hole in the trunk floor to pass the tubing through to use as a vent.




There are drain plug grommets in the wells at either side of the trunk compartment (more easily seen from outside than inside) that could be used to route a vent hose without needing to drill another hole.


turbowop
(Hard Snarker)
03/12/11 07:43 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Yeah, those could be used as well. I wasn't trying to make it seem like drilling a hole was a bad thing. I was just pointing out that a hole needs to be made to run the vent tube through, be it through a grommet or the sheetmetal. I don't mind making holes, I just didn't see the need to with my sealed battery and no issues passing tech the way it is.

iceman69510
(Turn Right Racing)
03/12/11 08:28 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

No sweat Mark, just mentioning an alternative. I have done this in two cars, without venting.

turbowop
(Hard Snarker)
03/12/11 09:45 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

No sweat indeed.

14u2nV
(Resident Pedobear)
03/13/11 12:18 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Quoting mitsuturbo:

I need to figure out how I'm going to do this, and have a kill switch that actually shuts the car off.




Will a kill switch hooked inline to the fuel pump not work (with battery in trunk and a rewire, it would be right there)? I would think that would be best as it would def kill the fuel supply, but I don't know about all those type of rules.


**DONOTDELETE**
(Unregistered)
03/13/11 12:07 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

When it comes time to relocate the battery to the trunk is the little 4 fuse connector need to be moved back there with it, as in the first pics?
one of the PO's moved the Batt. to the trunk on mine but the 4 fuse connector is still in the engine bay and was frying for some reason only when the car was running of coarse...


PreskitVR4
(Member +)
03/13/11 12:26 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation



im using this for power dist when i relocate


turbowop
(Hard Snarker)
03/13/11 03:07 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Quoting Ga_Sumo:

When it comes time to relocate the battery to the trunk is the little 4 fuse connector need to be moved back there with it, as in the first pics?





No.


**DONOTDELETE**
(Unregistered)
03/13/11 05:03 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

cool, wonder why its frying tho..

mitsuturbo
(Banthony )
03/15/11 01:17 PM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Quoting 14u2nV:

Quoting mitsuturbo:

I need to figure out how I'm going to do this, and have a kill switch that actually shuts the car off.




Will a kill switch hooked inline to the fuel pump not work (with battery in trunk and a rewire, it would be right there)? I would think that would be best as it would def kill the fuel supply, but I don't know about all those type of rules.




It's SUPPOSED to kill the car immediately. The only way to do that is to cut ALL power. I just had another idea, actually.. and that's to use a 2nd circuit on a kill switch to kill the main MPI relay. That shouldn't be susceptible to voltage drop much if at all Since it's a RELAY. I just have to find the "signal" wire and run it back. I believe this would kill all ECU activity, including spark and fuel.


SleepinGVR4
(What are we going to do today Ferb?)
03/18/11 11:56 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

Just wanted to make a little comment that is relevant to this thread. I asked Curtis some questions able having sufficient grounds when relocating the battery. He said that not having enough grounds can cause a lot of weird problems. IE. gas mileage, lights dimming, idle problems, etc.

So I decided that I didn't have enough grounds and ran another ground from the battery to where the lap belt bolts to the body (didn't get a long enough length to go all the way to back up to the engine bay). I plan on running another ground from lab belt bolt to the engine bay.

But just adding this one extra ground gave me almost 100 extra miles to a tank of gas. I was only getting 200 miles to a tank, and that will put a dent in your wallet when you daily drive your car. But yesterday I did some highway driving and in town driving and got 285 miles to a tank. With another ground, over 300 miles to a tank is definitely possible.


mitsuturbo
(Banthony )
03/19/11 01:54 AM
Re: Battery Trunk Relocation

I've just ordered an extra 17ft of 1/0 Gauge wire for my ground. I plan to ground this wire about every 2 ft until one of the engine/tranny bolts. I've now 34 feet of 1/0 Gauge wire. 17ft blue and 17ft black. I'll be sure and document my install for others. My battery setup has cost me about $500 so far (including optima yellow top). I'm hoping it will look damn good and work out well.


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