BOV/BPV location on IC piping

[toybreaker]

Quoting BOOSTIN HARD:
One thing I would like to say, God blessed me with some pretty good understanding on certain things and cursed me on others, like my super small penis, and my impotent problem and my pre-ejaculation situation, but he did give me the understanding of how air flows. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Now the cats out of the bag. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif



Damn,...

I knew you getting rid of your truck and getting a volvo would have ramifications and reprecussions... but damn man...



That_is_too_ much_information. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif



But, hey it's your story, tell it like you want. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif


I'm just glad those years of therapy are finally paying off, and you can discuss your little issue without breaking into tears.



p.s., just because you go psssshhht every time you shift doesn't mean you know jack sh*t about airflow, juniour.





p.s.s. Might want to lock the door to the basement when you're running the "flow bench".

There's talk around that it's actually more like an industrial version, souped up, swedish patented, red neck re-engineered penis pump...









It would really suck if that secret got out wouldn't it? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/fawkd.gif

 

[Andy_S]

Throttle plate loading and reversal of air aside, would placing the bov near the compressor outlet allow the compressor wheel to maintain its rotation easier? My thought is that because pipe bends and intercoolers are restrictions, the air could continue to flow through the turbo and out the bov without fighting these restrictions (which would slow the turbo speed accordingly... maybe). Could this result in boost picking up faster between shifts?

 

[Rausch]

Quoting toybreaker:
I've been missing the little wiener guy support group meetings lately,as I seem to perpetually be mixing up the Viagra with my Alzheimer's medication. Which, oddly enough it's that big of a deal, as I tend to forget why it was hard in the first place.

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

My understanding was always that the closer the the throttle plate, the less stress on the system. Had something to do with surge/stall and waves, but I think I made Toybreaker's mistake as well, and can't really pin down the finer points...

 

Quoting toybreaker:


p.s.s. Might want to lock the door to the basement when you're running the "flow bench".

There's talk around that it's actually more like an industrial version, souped up, swedish patented, red neck re-engineered penis pump...









It would really suck if that secret got out wouldn't it? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/fawkd.gif



I tried that and it worked but I blew a bunch of blood vessels. It hurt real bad. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

 

[curtis]

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif

 

[toybreaker]

Quoting BOOSTIN HARD:
Quoting toybreaker:


p.s.s. Might want to lock the door to the basement when you're running the "flow bench".

There's talk around that it's actually more like an industrial version, souped up, swedish patented, red neck re-engineered penis pump...









It would really suck if that secret got out wouldn't it? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/fawkd.gif



I tried that and it worked but I blew a bunch of blood vessels. It hurt real bad. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif



Yea the neighbors probably still have nightmares from the sound...








...just the sound...







I hear tell it was like a 747 at full song sucked up a pomeranian...





got a bleeder here /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/runrofl.gif

 

[prove_it]

This thread delivers!

 

[curtis]

Sounds like Chris's flowbench does to. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif

 

It does the clean up work too. There is a large white spot on the wall close to the discharge of the bench. Now I know what thats from. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[broxma]

I did screw up a definition about the velocity. I claimed flow along the long radius will do two things, compress and speed up. I cannot find an answer as to if the flow on the outer wall speeds up or if the inner wall flow slows down. This is in spite of the fact that the velocity of flow at the outer wall and inner wall are different and the inner wall is slower which was my point in general. Gotta have a source though.

Fundamentals of Hydraulic Engineering Systems
3.10
"Pipe flow around a bend experiences an increase in pressure along the outer wall and an decrease in pressure along the inner wall. A certain distance downstream from the bend, the velocity and pressure resume normal distributions. To achieve this, the inner wall value must rise back to the normal value. The velocity near the inner wall of the pipe is lower than that at the outer wall, and it must also increase to a normal value."

This very much supports my pressure/velocity statement earlier. This applies to any Newtonian fluid and is measurable as either exerted force on the tube in the case of a true liquid or internal pressure as in the case of a gas. The earlier statement that air flows much like a liquid I don't disagree with, but I was making the point that the turbulence cause by the change in direction on the outer wall of the tube results in an isolated increase in pressure(density) at that location specifically in a gas. In a true liquid, this pressure is exerted on the wall of the tube but due to the incompressible nature of the fluid, the density does not, well cannot, increase. I do not claim to know much about wet flow benches other than garage talk and research, but from I gather, it simulates real world conditions inside the head by spraying a liquid in with the airflow. I don't think anyone would argue that the pressure differences from Fundamentals book applies to a gas containing suspended liquids. It would also explain why dry benches test differently than wet benches since the introduction of the heavier, non-compressible fluid into the airflow.

On the energy loss through a curve we have to go to A.Graham Bell and not the phone guy, the car guy.

“To compensate for flow loss caused by bends, decrease horsepower by 5% for each 90 degree bend."

Direct energy loss due to increase in bends. Someone asked if I had measured this. Didn't have to. Other infinitely more intelligent people already did. I am not sure if his numbers are dead on but he wrote a book on the subject and I didn't. I asked Cork about these numbers and he said they sounded pretty close to him. These loses are simply inherent in the system and are overcome by increasing boost levels or other ways of adding power. Note the 5% is for a 90 degree bend, not firing into a box and redirecting airflow entirely. That percentage is much higher. Ease of installation doesn't make up for lack of good design in my opinion.

As for the Surge destroying turbo scenario, the LeMans analogy has consistently showed this notion to be unfounded. Not having a BOV on your car is a very easy way to deny a warranty claim though isn't...Garret, which by the way was the stock turbo on the Non-BOV equipped GN. I've not heard of a rash of GN turbo failures. My argument is a fallacy based on just that premise I know. But my experience tells me the argument is sound.

I love these technical threads where I learn something.

/brox

 

[solidviper89]

Learning indeed.

 

[Polish]

The turbocharger was a reverse rotation Mitsubishi TD04LR-16Gk with a 6 cm2 (0.93 sq in) turbine inlet. Tight packaging forced some creative thinking on the turbocharger. The TD04 compressor has a compressor bypass valve built right into the compressor housing. The exhaust manifold and turbine housing were cast in one piece by Mitsubishi from high-nickel Ni-Resist steel.


- Small section of an article talking about the Mitsubishi turbo on the SRT4.

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

^So you are telling me that engineers put bypass valves wherever they can fit them because it doesn't matter where you pop a balloon? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif

 

[Polish]

Yes, that is exactly what I am saying. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif