#418/2000 restore & mod thread.

[4g6Tree]

That catch can is a new one on me, I like it. I went with the Monster can my old 1g, but the water bottle is probably healthier /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

I really like the way that vinyl came out and the gray color. Very nice work Nate.

 

[NateCrisman]

Add that to the "to-do" list: proper catch can and proper radiator overflow bottle. both are temporary at best as they are.

 

[NateCrisman]

Tuning is going pretty well, I have the DSMlink boost control working nice at 25psi, the car spools fairly quick and holds rock steady (duty cycle about 43% to make 25psi, and about 35% to run 20psi.)
Running the stock evo8 timing maps for both min/max octane, Im not screwing with them yet. Pulled a couple degrees out at 4000 and 4500 where Iv seen a couple degrees of knock occasionally.

AFR wise..Im targeting 11.0:1 once it's up on boost, Straight 93 pump gas on FIC 750s @ 45psi base (-45.7 global). you can see the VE map in photo below. Im seeing IDC well past 80% by 6500 and topping 95% at 7800 which is kinda disappointing...going to have to upgrade injectors, although Im going to hold off on that decision till I either part a car with 850/950's or think through adding a meth kit.

OH...missfire was a super easy fix: the car had BPR6EKN plugs with those double ground straps with huge gaps. Did a comp test while plugs out...4-3-2-1-: 145, 145, 160, 165 (not wonderfull balance). Motor is supposedly a "built 2.0 with cams" so who knows. Im still seeing some exhaust smoke since changing the intake manifold, so... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif put it back together with BR8ES gapped to .020". misfire absolutely gone.

only other thing of note: Im hearing some kind of fluttery sound during spool up, and I don't see the map sensor fluctuating like when the turbo surge happens (seen that many times on mine and nelsons cars with BB FP30's) ...I suspect BOV. The car has a crushed 1G oem boV that has an additional vac nipple threaded into the flange.."dodge garage mod" style. I don't have a vac hose hooked up to it, and when that's vented, it should hold rock solid but lose the "quick lift/easy open" assist. I don't trust it.


Tomorrow Im planning to go to Island Dragway and make a few pump gas fun passes with easy 60' (still have the oem pos 3bolt open rear end that I don't want to break). Ill work on the tune tomorrow, hook up the clutch wire for NLTS, and give that boy a look see.

 

[NateCrisman]

Did some more "street tune" pulls this morning with the boost at 25, and the car pulls pretty damn hard. Link showing about 375hp on flat ground in 2nd/3rd gears at 7000+. It's defiantly an RPM motor, even with the stock intake manifold due to the cams and big turbo, going to want to be bouncing the thing off the 8000rpm limit each shift. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/devil.gif My butt dyno says it's going to trap 116-118mph as is.

fuel wise...Iv been cranking up the IDC each pull and not seeing much AFR change, especially in the peak torque areas 5500-6500rpm where the duty cycle is still only in the 65-76% range. Im thinking the fuel pump is not adequate (I don't even know what it is...for all I know it's a 190 walbro or one of the super old school nipponsenso pumps that are only like 150lphr and only good for 400hp) I don't really have time to pump swap today, and if that's the cause...my "tune" is going to be all out of whack once fuel pressure is steady and I'll have to redo it. Will leave well enough alone for the week.

Here is a iPhone pic of a clean 2nd gear pull with the curser at max power

Here's a pic of the fuel map changes in response to the above log:

Will go for another test log today and see whats up.

 

[NateCrisman]

Took it to Island Dragway last night, drove it to the track, drove it home, nothing broke: SUCCESS!

seriously, I'd forgotten how much fun it was to just drive a car to the track, row gears, make tuning changes, and enjoy the car regardless of how fast/slow it runs.

Here's the slips in chronological order:. First run was literally just rolling out, second was 5000rpm studderbox launch but really slipped the clutch alot and early 1-2 shift, third run a let it out too quick and it bogged bad , run 4 was pretty decent with a little bit of tire spin in first. Trans goes into all gears well, I hooked up the clutch wire for NLTS (used on last 3 passes). Im pretty happy with it all together. If I wasn't afraid of busting a 3bolt rear axle, I'd have worked on the leave and maybe seen an 11.9 to 12.0 but whatever, there's always a next time.

So....I was running pretty high boost and very low timing...like 26-28psi boost and timing from about 3* up to a measly 6* at 8000. seeing random knock blips..like it might knock only in second gear and be clean in 3-4, then next run clean 1-2-3 and knock in 4th. not a lot of info to go on, so I kinda just left it be.

I think my next mods are going to be:
4bolt rear - I want to be able to confidently push it a little harder off the line and get the 1.60-1.70 short times on street radials and still drive it home at end of night.
Meth kit - I'd like to be able to run it with an everyday tune file and only have to make minor adjustments at the track between passes. Im close to max on the injectors too.
New BOV - car has a crushed 1G valve that's got the "dodge garage mod"...and it doesn't freaking open at all, wonder if it's like bent/jammed closed. all it does is annoyingly squeal on decal.
Cold Air pipe - I have another 90* alum 4" pipe that goes to headlight area and turns forward. a quick "ram air" pipe for track use only..remove air filter & headlight. should help.

I may swap out the knock sensor for a new one Iv got kicking around just to see if it changes the semi-random knock retard behavior in the logs.

other than performance mods..i still have body assembly (rear bumper needs brackets made), wing to wrap and install, and interior repairs to accomplish. I did get the rest of the glass trim, the JDM-YO foglights, and clean rear seats put on. Gotta get VFX-Custom to cut me some vinyl lettering with my partout website and #2403 so they can stop with the shoe polish!

All together...it's coming along nicely.

 

[NateCrisman]

Bought a used meth kit, will hopefully have it in hand by end of week, and get play around with it soon. Im kinda spending my mental energy this week deciding how I want to activate, tune, and failsafe this methanol injection setup. Likely going to be getting ahold of an AEM meth flow gauge that I can log and use to activate the secondary min octane maps when the meth flow doesn't happen. Tune the regular maps for the meth flowing.

Since friday, Iv also turned the boost down to 20psi and still getting the flutter/surge sound on spoolup, which Im going to attribute to BOV. That's on my immediate plan to change for a Tial...have one here...just need to order an aluminum flange.

 

[NateCrisman]

Meth kit installed, sorted out a bunch of issues with leaks, fitment, and misfires. Got it working pretty well, as the above screen shot shows. Picked up a significant chunk of power vs the 93oct only tune I ran at the track few weeks ago. Planning to go back to Island on friday 7/22/16 for another test night. Will continue to raise boost/timing till I hit the limit with the single M10 nozzle and then re-assess where to go from there (add another nozzle?)

 

[ApexHunter]

Sweet. Earlier you had mentioned that the car had an unknown fuel pump and you may have been exceeding its capabilities. What ended up being the deal there?

 

[NateCrisman]

I pulled it out, it ended up being a GSS341 walbro 255hp. plenty of fuel. I was jumping the gun when assuming I was out of fuel, it just needed more fine tuning on the VE map. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif not sure what I was thinking at the time, but as usual, I was probably changing three variables at the same time and not keeping track, and making myself "chase my tail" a bit in assuming I had problems that didn't actually exist.

It's all good now. Injector duty cycle is now under 80% since Im spraying alky, and will likely add another meth nozzle and put in about 50% more...which should take the IDC down even further.

 

[ApexHunter]

Interesting, thanks. Good luck Friday.

 

[NateCrisman]

No luck ! The car started smoking pretty bad again on the way to the track...like "James Bond 007" style smoke screen. I figure I'll still try to make a pass or two, knowing the turbo is likely on it's way out. Ends up I can't pass Tech Inspection, cause my NJ Driver's Lisc expired. hahaha They sent me packing. Drove the car home...smoke got progressively worse and I kept watching oil pressure!....bet I burned nearly 2qt on 15 mile drive home. #418 is sitting in my drive way with a little 3" dia puddle of oil under the muffler tips. Literally oil drilling out of the exhaust.

Will limp it up to the shop and pull the turbo tomorrow possibly. Hopefully no damage to housings and I can get it rebuilt at a reasonable cost.


BOOOO

 

[NateCrisman]

Turbo was off , identified (as an FP 3176HTA journal bearing model rated for 59lb/min....it's basically the journal bearing equivalent of the DSM76HTA, just with a T31 / stg3 T3 turbine wheel), looks to be easily rebuildable, and was sent off to a facebook-friend Jeremiah Morrow to be repaired. I gotta ez-out one of the 6 bolts holding the turbine housing to the cartridge that broke ...but otherwise this should be a quick down-time. maybe have the turbo back in little more than a week. While the turbo and radiator are out, Im thinking of doing the ABS delete, moving some underhood clutter, and swapping the OFH for a 90 style with an external oil cooler. will also put the proper water pipe on so I can put water to the heater core.

Hope to get the car to Island before going to the shootout.

 

[transparentdsm]

heck yeah Nate!! the car really came together fast, the tune looks awesome. shame about the turbo, but better now when you have the opportunity to take care of it and looks like it inspired you to do some other things.

 

[NateCrisman]

yeah...well...the car was smoking since I got it...heavy at first, then it kinda went away a little after removing the pct hoses from intake manifold, then less smoke after swapping to a clean intake manifold. but seems the turbo did not like 30+psi and the smoke got horrendous on friday on the way over to the track.

Ill get it back together asap, and Im itching to go make a pass at the track...cause the meth did wonders for the knock threshold on the tune. I was able to run about 5psi more boost with a normal looking timing curve vs just pumpgas before knock starts up and obviously that was a significant power jump. I think Im going to order up another nozzle holder and a T fitting so I can add in a second injection point and feed in a little more alky. Thinking of possibly doing a solenoid on the larger nozzle and having the DSMlink open the noid on the bigger one at a second point little higher up. like turn on the pump with the FPS output earlier than I currently have it...say start as low as 10psi, and if I use a smaller nozzle with just a check valve (as I have it now) like an M5 i can likely avoid the misfire. Then have the EGR output open the solenoid as a "second stage" of ally with the big M10 or even M14 jet, but have that only come at like 17psi. staggering might give me a little more tuning ability to both flow a lot more ALKY and be more aggressive on the tune still, but avoid the misfires from too much allky down low, while still getting some amount of allky for knock resistance as spool happens.

 

[transparentdsm]

now that is something i would like to see. a dual stage meth kit ran through link, innovation baby!!! i wish link would make a meth/alky tab so all you needed was a solenoid and it could run off your map sensor, also allowing you to do boost and fuel, + or - by percentage. then you could run the AUTO Power/ECO switch to turn on and off meth and bring the tune back to a straight pump gas tune. the day i see this is the day ill def start to run meth. for now im gonna squeeze every thing i can out of the PTE6152e on the uncut 92 i can get locally.


Nate, would you mind if i asked you a few questions about tuning my personal set-up? Not asking you to tune my car, just asking for some guidance.

 

[NateCrisman]

Quoting transparentdsm:
now that is something i would like to see. a dual stage meth kit ran through link, innovation baby!!! i wish link would make a meth/alky tab so all you needed was a solenoid and it could run off your map sensor, also allowing you to do boost and fuel, + or - by percentage. then you could run the AUTO Power/ECO switch to turn on and off meth and bring the tune back to a straight pump gas tune. the day i see this is the day ill def start to run meth. for now im gonna squeeze every thing i can out of the PTE6152e on the uncut 92 i can get locally.


Nate, would you mind if i asked you a few questions about tuning my personal set-up? Not asking you to tune my car, just asking for some guidance.




I really wish Link with 1G ecu had another programmable pulsewidth modulated output (like boost control logic) that you could use for a progressive alky activation. Run a BIG ASS meth nozzle and bring it in smoothly with boost and be able to have rudimentary tuning of meth flow at 500rpm intervals. That would also make a global fuel change work out, cause you can specify a global fuel change, then adjust the meth flow to be consistent with rpm.

honestly, this is basically what all the aftermarket progressive controllers already do, Id just much rather have it on-board and integrated into the datalogs and have the super fine tuning ability bs the controllers that are just two arbitrary knobs labeled start/full that tap into your map sensor. and you have to experimentally figure out what the activation points are.

anyway....I may just slap the M18 single nozzle on my car, wire up the Devil's Own progressive controller that came with the kit, and see if that helps with the stumbling and wet misfires.

As far as the eco switch/pump gas tune....I wouldn't ever bother. I would literally NEVER want to run the car hard on pumpgas only once I have the meth kit installed, Id never touch the button. If the kit failed or I ran out of meth...well...just don't go wot till you fix/refill. I wouldn't waste my time fooling around with the pumpgas only tune knowing Ill never run it. hahaha

It would also be a nice minor addition of DSMlink someday added a basic "cut off the boost control noid" that you could tie to the FPS/EGR/idle switch input. Basically, all the commonly available Failsafe methods integrate with link well, but there is no internal way to "kill the boost" internal to the ecu when your failsafe goes off and have it show on the log. Guess ill just put a relay inbetween one of the boost noid wires to cut out if the failsafe triggers.