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Cleaning up the wiring harness


GSTwithPSI
A hole
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200486 posted 02/02/15 05:35 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I'm in the process of making some improvements to the overall cleanliness of my engine bay. One of the things I wanted to address was the wiring harness. Although I like the look of a full tuck, it's just not very practical. Not to mention, I'm too lazy to do all the work it takes to complete the job correctly. I'm in the process of removing all the old shitty ribbed wire covering now, and need to replace it with something. I could just replace it with new ribbed covering, but I'm not sure I want to.

In addition, I'm grouping connectors together according to where they run in the engine compartment. That way, I don't have one huge bunch of wires snaking along the firewall. I can isolate the harness pairs I need, and route them appropriately according to the sensors they need to reach.

Here's what I'd like to accomplish.

-Put new sheathing in place without having to de-pin all the connectors
-Something that looks decent
-Fairly cost effective, although I'm willing to spend some cash for something that really looks good
-Something that will protect the wiring and ensure longevity

Any ideas, tips, tricks, or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.




820/1000
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1546/2000-SOLD
1813/2000-SOLD


Edited by GSTwithPSI (02/02/15 05:37 PM)

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prove_it
my racist jokes aren't actually funny
715/1000
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200488 posted 02/02/15 05:44 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
IDENTIFY every thing before going deep and not knowing what that wire is for. Take your time. lots of time. Stock up on tape, solder, heatshrink, and be ready to get confused.

I'm in the same boat as you, so I'll be following this to learn from your mistakes(if made).

Do not full tuck the engine harness. I've thought about it. Once I realized the whole harness needs to come off for engine removal, I figured it would bite my ass later on.



#1284/2K NB, Totaled
#715/1K KG, Rebuilding
02 Acura TL daily duty unit

12yr+ Vr4 owner.
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pot
It's a twee shaker----choot him choot him
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200489 posted 02/02/15 05:53 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I'll have some in depth notes for you shortly Brett. I've had the luxury of using a donor harness for the better part of six months to get nice and comfortable w/ the engine management portion of the harness i.e. ECU.

Of note, strokin4dr posted a few years ago of his handy work, might be worth taking a look at. I'll touch base w/ you later this week into next once I get a few customers cars out of my backlog.



182/1000

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bradrs
Member


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200513 posted 02/02/15 09:43 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting GSTwithPSI:

I'm in the process of making some improvements to the overall cleanliness of my engine bay. One of the things I wanted to address was the wiring harness. Although I like the look of a full tuck, it's just not very practical. Not to mention, I'm too lazy to do all the work it takes to complete the job correctly. I'm in the process of removing all the old shitty ribbed wire covering now, and need to replace it with something. I could just replace it with new ribbed covering, but I'm not sure I want to.

In addition, I'm grouping connectors together according to where they run in the engine compartment. That way, I don't have one huge bunch of wires snaking along the firewall. I can isolate the harness pairs I need, and route them appropriately according to the sensors they need to reach.

Here's what I'd like to accomplish.

-Put new sheathing in place without having to de-pin all the connectors
-Something that looks decent
-Fairly cost effective, although I'm willing to spend some cash for something that really looks good
-Something that will protect the wiring and ensure longevity





People like split corrugated loom, but it can be very abrasive on wires. Both on wires outside of it, and also the wires inside it. So taping the harness first, then looming, and then taping the loom together would make it look really good/ lasta long time.

There is another company that makes a split loom out of a fabric material that would probably work pretty well for this. I am pretty sure waytek sells it.

But something to think about, is if the loom is that toasted, how good are your wires? Over time, the heat will have damaged the sheathing, and the wires will become brittle. And unsealed connectors will get corrosive damage that follows the wire under the wire sheath.

Routing them together might look good, but be careful if you are routing some high current noisy wires next to your cam/crank/O2 sensors.

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tektic
Senior Member


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200520 posted 02/02/15 10:45 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
If I had to do it again, and I still might I would ...
Keep it simple.
In separate looms
-Injectors, resistor
-knock, ac, brake
-Transistor , injection, fps
-cas, tps, idle, isc
-fan switch, coolant, o2,
-maf, wbo2
-alternator, ps , oil light

I might have forgot some stuff but you get the idea, right? Just group stuff together in smaller groups. I'd just be happy to get rid of that big plastic wrap around the intake wire cover thing. So just seperating the injectors from some other branches is huge.



7 1G DSM's now a GGSX build.

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prove_it
my racist jokes aren't actually funny
715/1000
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200537 posted 02/03/15 08:17 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Do you have quick connectors at the fuel injectors? If not, now is a good time to do that. They make life wayyyyyyy easier.



#1284/2K NB, Totaled
#715/1K KG, Rebuilding
02 Acura TL daily duty unit

12yr+ Vr4 owner.
Honda/Acura master tech.
Family Guy

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slugsgomoo
god hates stupid people
461/1000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200620 posted 02/04/15 11:35 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I used TechFlex F6 loom in my car. It's soft to the touch, you can coil it and it won't split apart and drop the wires, and it looks way better.

amazon link though there are many sizes available. On amazon, some vendors are cheaper than others, even with prime, so definitely search around.

I did heat shrink at the ends when I re-did my injector clips.




-andrew
{witty signature}
#461 Kensington Grey - 2.0L/T67/etc
2015 Triumph Tiger 800 XCx
2014 Ford Focus ST

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LIV4PSI
dyslexic 1051
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200623 posted 02/04/15 11:59 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
That looks really good Andrew. I'm basically getting ready to tackle the same project as Brett



-Craig
1501 Build Thread


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prove_it
my racist jokes aren't actually funny
715/1000
1284/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200624 posted 02/04/15 12:12 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I like it. Looks like I got a new project too. Damn you guys.



#1284/2K NB, Totaled
#715/1K KG, Rebuilding
02 Acura TL daily duty unit

12yr+ Vr4 owner.
Honda/Acura master tech.
Family Guy

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bradrs
Member


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200625 posted 02/04/15 12:16 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
The larger the holes in the braided sleeve, the more dirt that will get inside and act like sand paper on your wires.

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prove_it
my racist jokes aren't actually funny
715/1000
1284/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200626 posted 02/04/15 12:17 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Not if you regularly wash your engine bay I would think.



#1284/2K NB, Totaled
#715/1K KG, Rebuilding
02 Acura TL daily duty unit

12yr+ Vr4 owner.
Honda/Acura master tech.
Family Guy

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turbohf
anyone even read this?
613/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200630 posted 02/04/15 12:37 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
click <~lots of info on all wire tuck.


i would like to clean my harness up also. no tucked, just reman it. uses non-corregated loom (like slugs posted). replace connectors and wire as needed, remove extra crap. i did something simular on my CRX, went over almost every inch of the harness, made sure everything was the legnth that i wanted, every connector was good, no brittle old wires (replaced LOTS!). was a task. but 100% worth it. then reloomed it to look factory.


keep us updated. i would like to see how this goes.



Dustin
1991 GVR4 #613
1966 Chevrolet Chevy II Nova 400 4dr Sedan V8

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LIV4PSI
dyslexic 1051
1501/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200650 posted 02/04/15 02:20 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting bradrs:

The larger the holes in the braided sleeve, the more dirt that will get inside and act like sand paper on your wires.




My car stays pretty clean on its jack stands



-Craig
1501 Build Thread


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GSTwithPSI
A hole
820/1000
1837/2000



Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200674 posted 02/04/15 05:32 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting turbohf:

click <~lots of info on all wire tuck.


i would like to clean my harness up also. no tucked, just reman it. uses non-corregated loom (like slugs posted). replace connectors and wire as needed, remove extra crap. i did something simular on my CRX, went over almost every inch of the harness, made sure everything was the legnth that i wanted, every connector was good, no brittle old wires (replaced LOTS!). was a task. but 100% worth it. then reloomed it to look factory.


keep us updated. i would like to see how this goes.




Yeah, that's a great thread. I've seen it before. I'd love to do something like this:


Question: what are you guys using (as far as tools go) to de-pin your connectors with?

I really don't want to depin a bunch of connectors, but the more I consider it, the more I think that's the route I may go. Either that, or do something like Andrew did. It's just that I'm not too crazy about any of the split wire coverings that are available. The Raychem covering isn't even that expensive, and the look and protection it will provide is well worth the price. But, the work it will take to de-pin all the connectors and basically fabricate and reroute the harness will be pretty time consuming. If the harness was out of the car, it might be an easier decision, but I'm not removing the harness completely. I'm a little torn on what I want to do, honestly. In addition, I'll need to order the Raychem covering online, which requires planning. I'm more of a fly by the seat of my pants kind of guy

So many decisions...

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idreamidrive
Member +
394/1000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200692 posted 02/04/15 08:34 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
After doing the quick connectors on my injectors, I have been thinking about doing a rewire. I have only one problem, I want to use "factory" wire colors. I know I can get it done, but don't want to buy 250 ft of wire through Waytek Wire. Anybody know of a source that I can get wire color striping done on low volume on wire. Or does anybody want to do a group buy for wire?

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bradrs
Member


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200708 posted 02/04/15 11:20 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting prove_it:

Not if you regularly wash your engine bay I would think.




As long as you are scrubbing between each wire in the harness to remove the grit, you are correct. Otherwise the water would just be driving the grit into the harness.

This is just what some of the guys working for Delphi explained to me, regarding their harness design ideas. So I can't tell you that doing it a certain way the harness will fail in X years. I am just going off the things they told me regarding the grit inside the loom, presumably based on years of experience tearing down failed harnesses.

The sleeving I use on the harnesses has a very tight weave, and I haven't heard of any wire failures on those, in the near decade I have been making them. Of course, that might be 1 year of driving, and 9 years of jackstands for most of the cars

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bradrs
Member


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200710 posted 02/04/15 11:32 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting idreamidrive:

After doing the quick connectors on my injectors, I have been thinking about doing a rewire. I have only one problem, I want to use "factory" wire colors. I know I can get it done, but don't want to buy 250 ft of wire through Waytek Wire. Anybody know of a source that I can get wire color striping done on low volume on wire. Or does anybody want to do a group buy for wire?




I wouldn't suggest using Waytek for the 18 or 20 gauge wire. Their version of the automotive grade TXL and GXL are more prone to failure, and aren't what the OEMs use. The OEMs use a fine strand on the 18-20 gauge. Which is too bad, because their pricing on the custom striping and labeling is REALLY attractive. I've seen a lot of field failures of the wrong 20 gauge wire, so I'd never use anything but the fine strand.

I actually already bought up a bunch of the 20 gauge fine strand in solid and striped colors, just haven't sorted out how/if to sell it yet. It is a bit more expensive, but you get what you pay for.

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slugsgomoo
god hates stupid people
461/1000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200711 posted 02/05/15 12:15 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
The weave on this is reasonably tight, but frankly I've put ~300-400 miles on my car since 2007...

Even now that it's running I'm not planning on doing any real rain driving or rallycross.





-andrew
{witty signature}
#461 Kensington Grey - 2.0L/T67/etc
2015 Triumph Tiger 800 XCx
2014 Ford Focus ST

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idreamidrive
Member +
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200752 posted 02/05/15 03:56 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting bradrs:

Quoting idreamidrive:

After doing the quick connectors on my injectors, I have been thinking about doing a rewire. I have only one problem, I want to use "factory" wire colors. I know I can get it done, but don't want to buy 250 ft of wire through Waytek Wire. Anybody know of a source that I can get wire color striping done on low volume on wire. Or does anybody want to do a group buy for wire?




I wouldn't suggest using Waytek for the 18 or 20 gauge wire. Their version of the automotive grade TXL and GXL are more prone to failure, and aren't what the OEMs use. The OEMs use a fine strand on the 18-20 gauge. Which is too bad, because their pricing on the custom striping and labeling is REALLY attractive. I've seen a lot of field failures of the wrong 20 gauge wire, so I'd never use anything but the fine strand.

I actually already bought up a bunch of the 20 gauge fine strand in solid and striped colors, just haven't sorted out how/if to sell it yet. It is a bit more expensive, but you get what you pay for.



If you do decide to sell it, and its OE colors (or close to OE colors). I would probably be will to buy

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GSTwithPSI
A hole
820/1000
1837/2000



Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200757 posted 02/05/15 04:24 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Well, just ordered a bunch of Raychem DR-25. I decided to de-pin all the connectors and do this right. I'll update this when I make some progress.

Soooooo which one or you rich bastards has the fancy shrink tube label making machine? Looking for someone willing to print some labels. I'll reimburse for time and supplies...



820/1000
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1546/2000-SOLD
1813/2000-SOLD


Edited by GSTwithPSI (02/05/15 04:26 PM)

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bradrs
Member


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200777 posted 02/05/15 09:24 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
So shrinking Raychem over 25 year old wiring is doing it right?

Be careful around the connectors, and leave a little room between the Raychem and the connector, and try not to make the bends too tight just past the connector. Several of the installs in that Honda thread had the wire bent sharp right past the connector. You want to have bigger loops there.

You were asking for a depin tool. Pico 0660PT is a set from Summit for $7. Aside from that, some jewelers screwdrivers can help too.

I'd really suggest rethinking that and using the split loom to just repair the covering, I'd put money on damaging some wire, terminals, and/or connectors while doing the Raychem.

And while someone DOES have many/most of the connectors available new, it seems kinda silly to do all that for just a new wire cover on an old harness.

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GSTwithPSI
A hole
820/1000
1837/2000



Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200784 posted 02/05/15 11:15 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
25 years old or not, my harness wiring is in good shape. I'll assume that's because the shitty split loom and electrical tape did its job for the most part. It's the split loom and electrical tape that's trashed, not the wiring. I'm not sure what's giving you the impression the wiring on my (or others' cars) is messed up. It's not.

If I wanted to settle on split loom and electrical tape, I would have just left it be. The whole point of redoing the sheathing with the Raychem was to improve the overall look, while adding some extra protection to the wiring. Even cheap shrink tube from the hardware store would be better than electrical tape and ribbed split loom, which is what it came with from the factory.

I have a spare harness I cannibalize for connectors and such. If I screw one up removing it, i'll just replace it. I'll make sure to have proper loops and ensure there aren't any kinks in the harness, thanks for the tip. When all the stuff gets here, I'll post some pictures of the process.

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bradrs
Member


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200793 posted 02/06/15 12:49 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
The wire loom doesn't protect the wire from heat cycles, it only provides some mechanical protection. But that same loom also can damage the wires.

Corrosion that appear to start at exposed connectors(and there are quite a few unsealed connectors underhood) will work their way up the wires. Underhood chemicals will affect the wire sheathings over time. Vibration will have it's way with the in harness splices. Over time the wire and sheathing will lose flexibility.

What surprises me is you see the evidence of what 25 years underhood has done to the loom, and you don't think it had any adverse affects on the wires.

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pot
It's a twee shaker----choot him choot him
182/1000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200797 posted 02/06/15 06:54 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I began cleaning up the wiring harness on 182 about a year and a half ago. Prior to that, when I installed my AMS SMIM the harness left an eyesore with respect to the Injectors, Coil pack, Ignitor, and Throttle Cable. I began by rerouting the injector portion of the harness and breaking it up individually by separating the: TPS, CAS, Coil Pack, and Ignitor.

For reference there are 3 main separate portions of the harness:

- Engine Management Portion (ECU)
- Chassis Portion
- Interior

I focused my efforts on the ECU portion of the wiring harness with an emphasis on removing emission components and removing as many items from the firewall while ensuring I can still pass NC emissions. For reference I've included some images, This is how I started:



This little bugger behind the glove box needs to be removed in order to pull the harness in either direction through the firewall. Its held in place by a 10mm nut:



While it isn't necessary to remove the harness from the interior side if your only rerouting some of the items I mentioned earlier, but if you want to remove emissions and cruise control this is the way to go. Below are some of the components I removed:

Cruise Control Actuator



EGR Control Solenoid



Fuel Pressure Solenoid



Fuel Pressure Control Solenoid Valve



Brake Fluid Level Sensor



*I did remove 2 of the 3 grounds from the harness that are located on the firewall and found a spot for it lower on the firewall away from view along with the resistor pack. In addition, I relocated the Wiper Relay, Engine Timing Pin, and Fuel Pump Check Plug into the interior.

At 22 years old, I found 98% of my harness in like new condition. The trouble spots were around the water neck i.e. Coolant Temperature Sensor, A/C Coolant Temp Switch, the Coolant Temp Gauge Unit, and the other A/C plug.

There has been lots of good info on here regarding this process and required tools and materials. I agree with what some members have said with regard to taping the harness prior to placing it into the loom. I use 3M Super 33 as it thick enough to protect the wiring but doesn't leave sticky residue while remaining pliable. I do not recommend 3M Super 88 (having used it already) as it leaves more of a mess than when you first broke into the harness.

Below is a picture of the terminal pick set that I used throughout this process. I only bought this set about 3 - 4 years ago as it was on sale. My recommendation is to buy a good high quality set by OTC from Amazon. Same stuff, but better and cheaper. Be cognizant though, these tools have a tendency to snap, its not uncommon.



There's much more I probably left out but feel free to hit me up with any questions you may have. I found this to be one of the more enjoyable projects thus far. In the longterm, my plan is to:

- Completely relocate the entry point for the ECU portion of the harness to near where the shift cables enter the firewall
- Weld/bondo shut the original hole where harness enters now
- Relocate the fuse box behind the glove box



182/1000

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strokin4dr
fighting them with a large needle
1280/2000
1135/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 1200803 posted 02/06/15 09:31 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post   
Good luck with the project. I'm looking forward to the results. I know first hand how much work is involved in such a project.

I also stripped all ABS, auto seatbelt, etc wiring from the chassis harness. Easily over 10 lbs of wire removed



Ryan C.
1908- sold and missed.
1280- 2.3, FP 35R, E85, etc.
1135- 100% stock - 88k miles
'93 Mirage hatch- 4g63, AWD, etc (hoarding for build)

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