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To Auto or not to Auto (GVR4). That is the question...

bazeng

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 6, 2003
Messages
2,520
Location
Melbourne, Australia
Hi All,

What do you all think.
Built Auto or Manual Dogbox?

The car is no longer street registered or street driven.
I drive it once a year.
I'm yet to launch it hard. Things break when launching with the manual.

I've recently upgraded the axles but yet to drive.
Next step is the transfer case.

The car is biased towards a drag setup.

Thoughts?
Pro's and Con's?

I could sell my dog box and go auto and still have money my way.
My only concern is that i would lose the fun of shifting and launching.

Thanks All.
 

strokin4dr

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 30, 2005
Messages
2,770
Location
Savannah, GA
If you already have the dogbox, what are you waiting for? Get out there and use it.
If the car is really only driven that seldom, I wouldn't want to take away the fun factor of a manual to try and save some driveline parts.

What all have you broke in the past? What kind of hp/torque is it making?
 

gvr4ever

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 6, 2002
Messages
6,191
Location
central Indiana
How fast are you running the 1/4? They can be built up and I wouldn't say they are prone to breaking. The stock 1st gear is known to be too tall for the drag strip. I've personally been in a car that chewed up a GVR4 fist gear on a hard launch. Not sure of all the options anymore. I'd skip the 1G FWD 1st gear. It is too short IMO.
 

bazeng

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 6, 2003
Messages
2,520
Location
Melbourne, Australia
It ran a 10.9 @ 135mph with the dog box. 1.98 60 ft (no launch).
The run after i launched and broke the drive shaft at the uni joint.
That was the old setup.
360kw at the wheels. 482hp at the wheels.

New setup makes significantly more power.
425kw at the wheels. 569hp at the wheels. 24psi boost.
I have further plans for nos and more boost. 30+ psi boost.

Also now run a DSS drive shaft and DSS axles. Only missing a transfer case.
 

bazeng

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 6, 2003
Messages
2,520
Location
Melbourne, Australia
This is what i currently have:

dec43039.jpg


be2cc775.jpg


img.php


click
 

NateCrisman

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 22, 2008
Messages
2,054
Location
Blairstown, NJ
I think your absolutely insane if you DONT put an automatic in the car. You will run quicker ET, the car won't break driveline parts at that power level, it will be dead on consistent, and most of all IT WONT WASTE YOUR TIME. If the car is seldom driven, it means your a busy guy. How much does it suck ass to go to the track every so often, break the car on the first pass, and completely waste what little time you had to enjoy the car.

Sell your dog box. But an Auto/AWD driveline. Swap it. Go enjoy a car that will run a half second quicker with half as many headaches. BONUS: you were going to install a nitrous kit anyway, and that in itself, eliminates 3/4 of the headaches of getting an AUTO AWD to stall up and launch, because you can just spray it on the line to get it up on the converter...making your choice of torque converter kinda moot.

Manual trans are for slow street cars. Auto's are for serious cars. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/devil.gif

you probably have enough engine setup, that coupled with an Auto driveline....will run in the 9's easily every run ...consistently. ...without breaking.

Of course you can cling to your third pedal setup, be stuck in the 10's occasionally when it doesn't break, and keep hobbling down the track looking like a chump on the runs it breaks or you don't launch it for fear of breaking. Yeah..that's so so so much fun! (stupid manual trans) /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif
 
Last edited:

OldHairyBastard

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 27, 2005
Messages
4,510
Location
Northern Chicagoland Area
After breaking 7 transmissions, 3 t-cases and diffs I'd say go auto and spend less time wrenching on the car. Or let it keep being a JSB Queen!
 

marvinmadman

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 10, 2003
Messages
2,355
Location
Lafayette, Louisiana
I'm looking to go Auto. If anyone knows of a setup for sale please LMK!
 

89Patches

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 30, 2013
Messages
723
Location
Ontario Canada
He already has a Dogbox, he'll never break it. Once the factory gearset has been addressed (PPG Dogbox) it will break all the same sh*t as an auto car. Only reason I am saying stay 5 speed over auto is that your setup is 90% there.

Honestly the only thing that broke regularly in "my" dogbox car was the stock tcase and kept cracking the rear diff cover. f*** even the stock driveshaft lasted 2 years. BTW the car made just under 1000whp and full weight...
 

NateCrisman

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 22, 2008
Messages
2,054
Location
Blairstown, NJ
Quoting turbowop:
You trapped 135mph with 482whp? How in the hell? How much does the car weigh?



And it trapped 135 with no launch! Id bet with a WOT/Full boost launch it picks up 3-4mph by not having to spool the turbo through first gear and putting down full power for another 100ft of track.

go look what kind of dyno...there is the answer to 135 with "only482". Bet on a USA dynojet that's a 595-635whp car to trap 135 without a leave.
 

NateCrisman

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 22, 2008
Messages
2,054
Location
Blairstown, NJ
Quoting 89Patches:
He already has a Dogbox, he'll never break it. Once the factory gearset has been addressed (PPG Dogbox) it will break all the same sh*t as an auto car. Only reason I am saying stay 5 speed over auto is that your setup is 90% there.

Honestly the only thing that broke regularly in "my" dogbox car was the stock tcase and kept cracking the rear diff cover. f*** even the stock driveshaft lasted 2 years. BTW the car made just under 1000whp and full weight...



It's not about "breaking the trans". it's about botching the launch, spinning the tires, wheel hopping yourself into snapped axles/ujoints, shocking the Xcase and breaking it. Auto cars don't break that stuff nearly as often, and they are almost immune to driver error induced breakage.
 

turbowop

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 29, 2001
Messages
11,971
Location
Yakima, WA
Does a DynoDynamics really rate WHP that much lower than a Dynojet? I thought that was a Mustang dyno thing?

This is why I like to use trap speed and weight to measure performance.
 

bazeng

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 6, 2003
Messages
2,520
Location
Melbourne, Australia
Hi Mark,

I an honestly say that the dyno it gets tuned on is known to be the heart breaker dyno.
Although it is rather consistent across all dyno dynamics dynos.

I am very tempted to go auto with the comments above. Your feedback has been great.
Especially Nate and your comments about wasting my time.

The last race i had was with the new setup, spent 2 days preparing (not including the build). Got out there and would bog off the line, miss shifts, slipping clutches etc.

I believe it is because i don't drive the car much so have lost touch with how to drive it like it should be driven.
Although i do enjoy the challenge of a stick shift car, the cons do outweigh it significantly.

So instead of:
1. shifting the car
2. enjoying the challenge
3. fearing the drive line damage due to shock
4. missing shifts (due to old man syndrome)
5. inconsistent times

I will get:
1. less enjoyment in the driving aspect
2. steering only
3. less breakages
4. no missed shifts
5. quicker ET
6. consistency
7. enjoying my day racing instead of breaking

Will i be limited by the auto due to the 2.4L setup with big turbo?
Is a stock re-stalled 1G converter to 4000rpm suitable for this setup?


I've been offered a trade plus cash my way.
I don't want to take the offer and then end up down in cash due to the setup having the wrong parts.

The offer to me is:
- Quaife front diff
- locked center diff
- Shift kit
- Restalled stock 1g converter
- B&M ratchet shifter
- Electric Vac Pump
- B&M oil cooler
- Shift box
- new oil pump
- all mounts
- pedals
+ cash adjustment
 

bazeng

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 6, 2003
Messages
2,520
Location
Melbourne, Australia
He made a crank spigot bush and it stuffed up the original oil pump in the box.
Also where the spigot bush sits is not true center he believes.
So it is either a new crank and rebuild or change back to manual.
 

Gizmovr4

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 18, 2009
Messages
366
Location
andover,NJ
I like where this is going!! Nate and I are here to answer any questions you may have with your swap if you decide to go auto /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/devil.gif
You have a well built car it's time to put the power to the ground !!
 

GSTwithPSI

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 1, 2012
Messages
3,460
Location
SoCal
Quoting bazeng:

I will get:
1. less enjoyment in the driving aspect
2. steering only
3. less breakages
4. no missed shifts
5. quicker ET
6. consistency
7. enjoying my day racing instead of breaking




8. Save moar money...The most important one.
 
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